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2.9.0 is out...

Discussion in 'MASCHINE Area' started by Supercreative, Nov 20, 2019.

  1. René must be Unique

    René must be Unique NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,874
    I have COPD for years now, but that is off topic.
    Because I am a beta tester and keep using the beta software until the next beta version,
    I no longer see the updates in NA.
    Because I am leading one version. ;)

    René
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Andrew Stirling

    Andrew Stirling NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    43
    All current products apart from a version of traktor are good to go


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  3. Tony Jones

    Tony Jones NI Product Owner

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    342
    I can feel an upgrade coming on!
     
  4. HammyHavoc

    HammyHavoc NI Product Owner

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    1,234
    Bitwig is a DAW from some of the original Ableton Live team. Comparing something like Maschine to Bitwig is an exercise in futility as they're not really comparable products in user base, nor intent. There's no hardware to purchase with Bitwig, though the 8-Track version is bundled with quite a few hardware products, so the userbase is naturally far larger. Maschine serves a very specific niche with the workflow it provides, especially the DAW integration, whereas Bitwig doesn't integrate with other DAWs ala Reason's Rack or FL Studio's VST.

    I will also say this much about Bitwig: they promised collaboration features in 2.0 over LAN and WAN, and they've yet to materialize, and to me, that would have given it a real edge over most DAWs. Years back, I liked Bitwig's touch-friendliness (was nice on a Surface), but they're lagging behind in a lot of areas that are important to me, hence the switch to Reaper. So whilst it appears that updates are coming quickly to Bitwig, the major features they sold people on are seemingly vaporware at this point, though their FAQ claims that networking is built into Bitwig and will be launched at a later date. They've been saying that for years. Remind anybody of Maschine Jam and song mode?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  5. D-One

    D-One Moderator Moderator

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    9,263
    Not so sure about that, Reaktor5 and Kontak5 are quirky and dont fully work, at least not for me, not an issue since I have the V6 versions for both and they do work fine but for someone who doesn't it could be a big issue. The Z2 is also not supported yet afaik.
     
  6. tempsperdu

    tempsperdu NI Product Owner

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    2,161
    Snap!!! groovy innit o_O:D
     
  7. Et_Voila

    Et_Voila NI Product Owner

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    rené: Ouch :/
    Hello D,
    @ everyone: Hello, I missed yall...


    Can you please explain a bit that part ? I must be dumb...
    You mean with this version, if you try to wire/sync/whatever and do something with the Z2 mixer: It's problems on the horizon if not worse?
    Seriously, as I bought it from you, man : I want my money back!
     
  8. Andrew Stirling

    Andrew Stirling NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    43
    I think when native instruments use the term current versions they’re referring to the latest available versions.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  9. AcidAlex303

    AcidAlex303 NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    168
    awesome, thanks. I need to check my VSTs first though before I update. Cheers!
     
  10. D-One

    D-One Moderator Moderator

    Messages:
    9,263
    LOL! It just means if you wanna use it you have to stick to Mojave for the moment...
    https://www.native-instruments.com/forum/threads/z2-catalina-support.363391/

    True... Touché... A Z2 is also a product tho :S
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2019
    • Informative Informative x 1
  11. muitosabao

    muitosabao NI Product Owner

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    442
    It's not about this or that feature having been delivered or not, but about an healthy thriving development, which Maschine has not.

     
  12. HammyHavoc

    HammyHavoc NI Product Owner

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    1,234
    You're right, it's about userbase. The userbase of paying customers for Bitwig is far greater than for Maschine, ergo you will see more frequent and major development. Bitwig is intended to be used as a DAW, you can even use Maschine with Bitwig, there is a lot less possible in Maschine than in Bitwig by their very nature as products, they're intended to be used quite differently, though there is a significant overlap between them, just like there's a large overlap between Reaper and Adobe Premiere (both can edit video).
     
  13. Kaldosh

    Kaldosh NI Product Owner

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    1,872
    I'd be curious to know where you get that info from... In anyway, this doesn't justify that and thinking that way you could spin around forever into nothingness
     
    • Like Like x 1
  14. HammyHavoc

    HammyHavoc NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,234
    You can take an educated guess; Maschine Essentials only recently became available, and it's only included with hardware purchases, whereas Bitwig 8-Track is available for free from their website, and bundled with several hardware products.

    There is also a far greater volume of Bitwig related content being created on YouTube than there is Maschine-related content.

    If you use the Google Keyword Planner for "maschine" and "bitwig", you're offered 64 potentials for "bitwig", and 0 for "maschine". You can also see the amount of traffic for people searching for "bitwig" related potential search phrases.

    I could go on.

    Like other users are forever telling me and others: buy Maschine and KK for what they do today, not for what you want them to do, because they may never do that. It's an assumption that in 2019 things will see ongoing major development, and IMO, Maschine does see development, but it doesn't need to develop at the same pace as Bitwig to remain competitive because there are very few options in the niche that it occupies, and at the price point that it also occupies. Bitwig however is competing with a lot of DAWs that have seen development for literally decades, and it has only been around for five years, thus it must develop faster to remain competitive and gain sales to fund ongoing development.

    How many people need an MPC-style production workflow with a hardware controller versus a DAW? It's mainstream necessity within audio production versus niche tool.

    If you need more functionality, you use Maschine within a DAW, I need a lot of functionality, especially a lot of niche functionality like video game middleware, so I use Maschine in a DAW. Maschine works fast for what it does, and it works in more or less the same way that I used to use an MPC. Is it ideal? Heck no, but what is in audio? It's all workflows cobbled together out of products from different manufacturers and developers with compromises across the board, but that's the tools of the trade for you.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2019
  15. tempsperdu

    tempsperdu NI Product Owner

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    2,161
    The question is if we saw more development with Maschine would we see a bigger user base? N.I's recent activities suggest they do crave a larger user base but some might suggest the way they are going about it isn't really optimal for anyone and perhaps in some areas at least a tad misguided By almost any standards the pace of development has probably been overtaken by several glaciers.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. HammyHavoc

    HammyHavoc NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,234
    Without a doubt, depending on what was being developed, IMO, a lot of people within the niche of wanting an MPC-style workflow who have or would have gone with MPC, Elektron etc for whatever reason would probably consider Maschine, though they're all quite different, but all have some element of overlap. I wanted to like Elektron and Akai's modern MPC offerings, but they just didn't tick the required boxes for me, especially with a lot of legacy content like Kontakt libraries going back to 2002/2003, just made sense to go with NI for me.

    That's not to say that Akai and Elektron don't innovate, of course they do, just like NI absolutely can. I genuinely think partnerships like Bitwig bundling their software with the hardware of other brands is a big win for adoption, that's a decades-old idea with Ableton Live, Pro Tools, Cubase etc all having done that, and continuing to do it. ARA integration on S1, Reaper etc have been great for Melodyne and VocAlign. No man is an island, neither is a tool, makes sense to partner with offering things that your own company doesn't.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. Kaldosh

    Kaldosh NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,872
    This make sense, ...about the referencing criteria I would not be that sure but you are certainly right, still this doesn't excuse that...

    Certainly...what would be the feedback from the last five years users if any newbie would ask him if Maschine is a good tool for music production ??? and same question to a bitwig user ? I go to a lot on different forums and it talks...a lot
     
  18. tempsperdu

    tempsperdu NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    2,161
    So many audio companies are making IOS apps now because there's a big market....surely there's going to be an avalanche at some point in Androids direction. To me the future is in utilising that and playing nicely with as many hardware and software solutions as is finacially feasible. The more versatile the more reasons to buy I would have thought. Unfortunately too many companies are trying to find ways to tie you in instead.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. HammyHavoc

    HammyHavoc NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,234
    Re avalanche of apps for Android; like with iMaschine on iOS, as an Android user, I would gladly pay a tenner for the equivalent, or ideally better, on Android. Not saying it would be a primary tool, but for explaining concepts to others quickly and jotting down ideas to later transfer to the VST, great. Would also be nice to record samples and import them into Maschine's VST from an Android device, especially combined with a class-compliant interface hooked up, would be a nice field recording tool for foley to be honest, and would also be a nice bridge for Mikro/Studio users who might not have an interface, but want to record some sounds.

    Lemur on Android is nice, though TouchOSC has surpassed it in several ways.

    An app for controlling NI's various synths, and particularly manipulating Reaktor, would be excellent. The Behringer DeepMind app for iPad is very cool. I don't have an iPad anymore, and have never owned a DeepMind, but have used them together and can say it's something I'd like to see happen with NI's soft synths.

    Edit: Reaktor is still superb for sound design. Lots of fun combined with my modular, but to be able to add some degree of touch support on the fly without much messing about would get a thumbs-up from me. Day one purchase for a tenner.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. muitosabao

    muitosabao NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    442
    Although I understand what you are trying to say, you are guessing (and i'm not sure you are correct)

    "There is also a far greater volume of Bitwig related content being created on YouTube than there is Maschine-related content." source? or Subjective perception?

    NI Maschine 6million google hits
    Ableton 25 Million
    Bitwig 1.4 million

    And even taking into account your point, the difference in user bases, i do not believe that they are so astronomically different to justify the homeopathic updates to Maschine in the lasts months, when compared to other audio applications.

    edit:
    one of the biggest bitwig has only 6k subscribers https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPI1x2iyASeNaeRYVSGXTqA
    Polarity music 3k https://www.youtube.com/user/polaritydnb

    compare this to the big Maschine youtubers.



     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2019