ABLETON 5 ANNOUNCED--and look out, NI

well Phil, I was always proactive for two seperate applications for FS and digital Traktor djs but I would reckon that this implies increased costs in development/support and advertising...

Anyhow, I am not complaining a bit cause I think Traktor 2.6.1 is a very stable product compared to previous versions and I am entirely happy about it. However, I am a bit sceptical on the future plans of Traktor since the interface has already reached a saturation point I would say. Traktor developers will need to improvise a lot if for example if a sampler or multiple elastic beatgrids will be added. But I just don't see how this can happen with the current traktor interface and the clash with the traditional dj set up which needs to remain in place for the FS users to be happy.

I guess it's impossible to keep everyone satisfied. "Stuck in the middle" is surely not a viable strategy according to Porter (famous economist) and I think that's where Traktor is heading.

If I was to make a bet, I see myself moving to Live entirely in a couple of months.

 

2.6.1 isn't safe!!! Get 2.6.2, many bug fixes (but not enough).

 

agreed I just don't see the interface being able to support higher functional density without layering or substantial change. The only other option is to increase the minimum required resolution to 1280X1024 and that is going to be HUGELY unpopular (I will rag on that so badly it will make em weep) plus it rules out a huge swath of systems that cannot do resolutions higher than 1024X768. Without changing the display metaphor, NI I think, have very little room to move. Adding layering, popup windows and collapsible scrollable panels is going to be an essential element among other tricks if we are to add substantial new functions to Tracktor.

Traktor cannot continue to hold middle ground and expect to survive. First and foremost, it has to get present functional and reliability issues
fixed! Second it has to become best in class as a DJ tool and clearly tell others 'you wanna play in this space? This is what you have to do and then some!!!' At one time Traktor was best in breed by a mile, today I fear its in the middle of the pack and struggling for lots of reasons. Its not too late to reclaim the crown but it has to happen soon and on lots of fronts.

You are not alone! I do not see myself going there anytime soon but I do expect to make MUCH more use of Live's new capabilities when mixing

 

About FS2,

I don't feel limited to only vinyl control. Now with Traktor studio's integration with FS2 I can do many things in the digital realm while still using my timecoded vinyl. (For ex. I can loop instantly while playing vinyl)

Having FS2 is pretty similar to buying a midi controller with jog wheels, the only difference is the turntable is a big ass jog wheel.

 

Phil , some comments on your post [based on neodjandre's post]

you say that if Traktor requires a bigger resolution , will make it widely unpopular , and then you say that Traktor cannot continue to hold middle ground and expect to survive..

I don't have a high-tech 17'' lap , but i think raising the requirements in order to add new stuff is totally right for me..

We all want new traktor functions , multiple beatgrid layers, 3rd and 4th decks , so can't have ask these and then complain bout the requirements..

i hope my lousy english make sense !

 

OK well let me see if I can make my lousy english past explaination more clear. As for your comments, your english is fine and you make a good point.....

My point in my previous message makes the same point you do. It is not going to fly with users that the minimum supported resolution be raised to 1280X1024 to cram more stuff into the already busy GUI. There are other ways to make use of the real estate that don't involve upping the ante on the hardware. Present screen and window component flippping in the UI is more capable of being handled on present systems. Requiring multiple monitors or monitors capable of high resolutions is NOT an acceptable advancement. for my Laptop I can run multiple monitors but my max resolution is 1024X768 because of the Tablet PC functions. I would scream blue murder were the minimum limit to be raised, because the vast majority of laptops in the user space today don't support more than 1024X768.

Don't get too wound over this, I'm sure we are stating the obvious, NI already know and realize this. We are speculating based on what we think the new version contains. The reality is that we know nothing about the features or implementation. Until we do, this whole discussion may be much ado about nothing.

Phil

 

Could be this solved by implementing skins on the software so the user haves what he actually uses on the screen? or would be this a mess for the code of the software. I know some think that skins are cheezy, but that would be a nice solution, and of course, some do great skins, some not, but could be handy, even to put traktor in 800*600 and have some other stuff around.

Just an idea!

I have allways said that NI should traktorize the Virtual DJ app. I wish i had all theese functions, but with the stability of Traktor.

Does anyone know why it is so hard to implement all those functions without ruining the app?

 

This is my first post so firstly, I'd like to say a big HELLO to everyone!

I read this thread with interest as I've recently made the switch to MP3 from vinyl / CD (for mainly practical reasons as I move a lot!). I've been using Traktor 2.6 for a while now but Ableton looked so cool I just had to try it.

Most of this thread seems to have been posted before the availability of the Ableton 5 demo (get it from the website, full functionality except saving). How many peeps have given it a try?

I've spent the last couple of days playing / fighting with it and I've discovered its not for me. If you're interested here's why:

1. Instability and setup issues (BUGS!). Had problems setting up my soundcard, using my Evolution X-Session, sound dropouts and even a crash. I've never had any serious trouble with Traktor.

2. Some of the little things that can make a big difference are missing from Ableton, namely crossfader curve control (its normal setting isn't right!) and no gain control for each channel. Plus you can only visually monitor the channel output once the upfader is 'up' (doh, too loud/quiet, doh, too late!)

3. Can't see EQ's and wave visualisation for all channels simultaneously so easy to forget an adjusted EQ or that crafty breakdown before its too late. Doh again!

Ableton certainly has bags of potential and can certainly do more than Traktor but I don't really need a package that does all the extra things. I just feel as I'm using a (very very) clever sequencer that has been ADAPTED for DJ use (...waits for a violent response from Ableton users!). Certainly though, NI need to sort out things like more than 2 decks, additional FX, and better implementation of tags (in order to make tracks portable) cos at the development rate of the Abelton boys and girls, each successive version of that app is gonna be better and probably more suited to DJ use.

As for the issue of bugs: at least NI and Ableton have made demos available and it shows the importance of giving each pacakge a thorough test drive on YOUR system to make sure it works. Stability is king - are you listening NI / Ableton?!

Ta ta all and happy mixing!

 

Yup. It's getting there though...

 

I never had problems setting up anything, but it's probably due to your specs.

Take it from a AL 5 user, each program is unique in it's own ways. Obviously things like crossfader curve, headphone monitoring, etc...Have been brought up in the "feature wishlist" part of the AL forum. Well anyway, I find AL to be great for making very, very interesting sets, and it's great to have control over every instrument, part of the song, and being able to mix, and match each part. However, Traktor (From what I have used on the demo) excells in the area of being able to just mix whatever you are feeling, but it obviously needs the "Warping" feature from AL for getting the tempo correctly set (This means making it so the track doesn't pitch shift), and marking cue points. I also perfered the fact, that all I had to do to match each track was either use the pitch slider in cojunction with the pitch bend buttons (To keep the track in sync manually), or just hit the "Sync" button, and it did a darn good job finding the right BPM values even without the tracks BPM information scanned. I think it would be ultamite to see a combination of what works in both applications.

 

Ignore the post above about suggestions...Just read the "Need a 3rd deck in Traktor 3.0" thread.