[Advice] What do you wish you had known or done when you first got your KK?

My S88 is arriving today! This is my first new MIDI controller* in I think 15+ years and I'm super excited And I'd love your advice / insights / opinions!

Specifically, with hindsight, what do you wish you had initially known or done when you first got your Komplete Kontrol?

I mean, I've done a ton of pre-purchase reading, gotten myself a Composer Cloud subscription**, been playing with FL Studio***, made sure my decade-old stand still, er, stands, bought a good SSD for the VSTs, and so on. But I'm sure there are things I'm overlooking! And especially AH HA! aspects / shortcuts / words of wisdom about the keyboard itself.

Thanks in advance for sharing your wisdom

* I bought a Roland LX-17 digital piano ~5 years ago and love it, but it's not (and can't fit) in the same room as my desktop computer... and buying the S88 was cheaper than buying a good new computer . And -- though both keyboards have weighted keys -- there's still something special about a digital piano that looks nice and can be played within a few seconds of sitting down.

** Yes, yes, I know... it's heresy to have gone with EW vs. NI sounds. But as I'm just re-starting out with composing after many, many years lapsed... I figured it'd be useful to spend $199 (at least once) to get a very broad soundscape overview & opportunity and then plan purchases accordingly from there. And at least the EW sounds are NKS compatible now <whew!>

*** Yes, yes, I also know that FL Studio is one of the few major DAWs that isn't natively (ha) supported by NI <sigh>. But from what I gathered, it seemed like one of the easiest DAWS for a hobbyist-composer to pick up, and a close friend who uses that DAW has eagerly offered to be a coach / tech support guy for me with it. Still have lingering thoughts of whether I should just start with, say, Cubase, though (the styles I enjoy composing are generally instrumental in nature).

 

That Native Instruments would basically turn a great idea into a long laborious process. I'm talking years.. The idea of Komplete Kontrol is great, yet without the ability to layer sounds, the name Komplete Kontrol is a bad choice of words.. It's not a Kore replacement, not even close. Sure the hardware is mediocre and popular among many pro's and hobbyists, and to some degree it does allow us to have a better option in terms of working with our plugins, but the product lacks so many advanced options.

1. This board should be able to chop samples with Maschine software, but they only allow sequencing with it.. So much for Komplete Kontrol.
2. Layering, obviously still not here..Komplete Kontrol not really..
3. The hardware should have better options ,a much better keybed, more knobs, and faders, we do mix right? Drive up the cost in pro models, good who cares, keep the low enders happy with limited features, but don't stop development on a better board for pros and enthusiasts that want better features.
4. Finally this is NOT the same innovative Native Instruments in the early 2000's , sure they have some talented dev's there, but even they will tell you, it's the NI headquarters politics, that has ruined a once very innovative company..
5. Still can't even resize the GUI.. The name Komplete Kontrol is laughable..
6. One more, working with 3rd party sounds, it's basically taken the strength and will of dedicated forum users to keep this keyboard and alive, with many of them spending alot of time just to allow themselves and others the ability to load 3rd party synths.. Native Instruments, still hasn't lifted an FINGER in that regard, there's too much wrong there to mention in this thread for just sound management alone.

We ALL have to demand more, and that means as customers, not dropping a dollar in their accounts,until they put out a real product, that we all want and deserve.

 

I can think of several more but these are the most important ones for me

1.- That the sustain pedal on the latest s88 has a bug and NI is still unable to fix.
2.- Unable to use more than 1 keyboard at a time with independent instruments and controls

 

Don’t let these comments put a downer on anything, it’s mostly users individual desires for specific features that don’t always apply as problems for others.

It’s not a “Komplete” solution to everything and FL prob wouldnt be my first daw choice with it but when it’s used for its strengths it really opens things up and speeds up finding sounds and getting to work. It’s an unfortunate fact that NI development speed is sloooooow, one of the slowest I’ve experienced in 25 years for sure but still plenty of fun to be had.

 

Please dont get me wrong I still love my NI stuff. (Jam, Studio, m32, s88and komplete 12 ultimate)

 

trusampler, good thing I'm just looking at this from the perspective of a hobbyist; I won't need "advanced options" for quite some time. As a longtime lapsed hobbyist composer, I'm looking for convenience, simplicity, etc. S88 might even be overkill for where I am now, but I figured it gives me some reasonable amount of space to grow.

Piniax, uh oh, your mention of a sustain pedal issue alarms me. I guess I should scour the forum for more info on that, but I just bought a Roland DP-10, and since piano is my main instrument I am hoping the pedal will work at least reasonably well with the keyboard!

JesterMgee, thanks for the reassurance . It is a bit disconcerting to come into a forum and be basically told, "YOU MADE A MISTAKE WITH YOUR EXPENSIVE PURCHASE! RUN AWAY RUN AWAY!" Not doubting or even resenting the sincerity and intent of such posts, but... :\. I kinda knew this forum was an unlikely place to have, er, largely upbeat conversations (in fairness, this seems due to real faults of NI's approach to their community!)... but I figured I'd give it a try. Out of curiosity, do you recommend another forum where I might get a more actionable set of new-user getting-started / wish-i-knew tips?

Oh, and I'm curious... if you were sort of just (re)starting out like me, what DAW would you choose? All of them have free or affordable starter versions and many (all?) have free trials, too.

And Piniax, whew, glad you've still got the love for NI, so I'm not feeling totally conflicted about my purchase now (seriously, thanks

 

Yeah the forums can contain some users that feel the features missing that they personally feel should be included or an issue that is either isolated to their circumstance or just minor is "GAME BREAKING MUST BE FIXED ASAP......". Like when 3 people post about the same issue over the span of 12 months instantly means there is a huge issue and it's now unacceptable. NI don't help there with the history of how they have played the game and even now, being almost non-existent around the place when there are actual issues that Apple introduced with Logic that need to be addressed by NI.

I think if you look at what you get on the tin and don't expect it to solve all your production problems you will get a lot out of it. I personally have 5+ years invested in it now and tho there are a heap of things I would welcome, some mentioned here already, I don't feel it's a major problem when I can easily work around that or just change the way I work a bit to accommodate, always welcome new development but rarely dwell on the "can't do" side of things, always looking at the positive as much as possible and there is plenty to be positive about.

These forums are actually pretty good for questions, there are a few helpful people round the place and as long as your not asking questions that can simply be looked up in the manual, most will be happy to help. There are some facebook groups around but I find the attitudes and info slide in scale a bit in those places.

In regards to a DAW, just get started with FL if you are already familiar with it. I believe you can now get transport working and you can manually switch instances of KK between tracks so most of the useful stuff can be done, but what you get with supported DAWs like Live or Cubase is more streamlined control such as being able to navigate between tracks on the keyboard and having all the controls appear for that instance of the KK plugin on your keyboard, being able to access the DAW mixer etc. This is where it has really helped me to go from "couldn't be fu$#ed automating that cutoff because i'm too lazy to host-map then learn a parameter" to just hitting rec and twisting a knob and having data laid down instantly. Sounds like a small gripe but after 2 decades of constantly midi mapping, tweaking and setting up every single action over and over you welcome all the tools that speed up the fiddly stuff. Not to mention I am also getting a lot more out plugins by finding sounds in there I would never have clicked on if it wasn't for the sound preview browser and all the libraries I generated to make use of it all.

Suggesting a DAW is a bit of a hard one because they all offer different workflows. I personally use Ableton Live which I love for the flexible non-linear workflow similar to how I use to work in trackers back in the 90s but I also use to use Cubase when it was CubaseSX3 many moons ago and for doing vocals and more linear "take based" recording it does a far better job at managing the session. If you really want the most out of KK, you want to check which DAWs offer full integration and trial one of them. Live may be horrible for you to use

 

I would say, don’t leave this forum just yet! being around this place myself as a NI noob for just a few weeks I was equally ‘amazed’ at the ‘sentiment’ that was around this forum.

Like you, and actually really happy with my purchase of s49/full K12, I was looking for a helpful, creative and kind environment. And I think that you will find a lot people here that actually WILL help you, and even share extreme enthusiasm and excitement ;-).

So please, do stick around, bring good stuff to the party, and we can make this place the forum we want it to be (...Including room for people’s frustrations/anger/beef!).

The Forum Is (all of) Us...

 

I think JesterMgee just proved my point

 

Second the Ableton use with KK, work well together for me and the way I like to make music. Generally speaking KK works well, and I have no issues with my S61mk2. Most people here, will help or try too.

Use your gear for what it's features can do today, not for what you hope or want it to do in the future.

 

Really appreciate the warm welcome! It's nearly 3:30am and I'm so excited about getting the keyboard tomorrow that I have kind of forgotten to go to bed

It doesn't help that I just discovered the Presonus Studio Sphere subscription, which includes the top versions of Studio One, Notion, and I guess every plugin/instrument that Presonus makes for $15/month or $165/yr. Given that Studio One 5 Pro alone is $400, that seems like a pretty impressive deal (less so for folks who already own some of Presonus' software or other crossgradeable software, obviously).

One potential downside (putting aside the inherent caveats of subscriptions) is that my gut suggests the Presonus instrument plugins probably aren't NKS compatible so wouldn't fit inside KK and thus wouldn't be natively (ha!) accessible in the S88. Is that assumption correct?

In the meantime, I probably should get some sleep. Thanks again!

 

From what I can see, the included plugins are just effects (EQ and Compressors mostly) and appear to be a proprietary format that is designed to only work in S1 so they wont load via KK. Same with Ableton Live, none of the included instruments or effects can load into KK but that's expected and why I personally also have a Push 2 which covers all the Ableton content I need. It's about figuring out what works best for the way you like to operate.

 

Ah, yep, bummer, that makes sense.

At the moment, though, I have an even bigger concern. Just got my keyboard, but it looks... not necessarily in new condition :\. Weird stickiness and blemishes around the wheels. And no paperwork inside the box whatsoever... no getting started guide, no activation key for KK, etc. Have already contacted the salesperson, but... ugh. Not a great way to start out.

 

Can't see the image you posted, appears you have it hosted somewhere? You can actually just paste images straight into this forum, no need to externally host them.

Yeah that doesn't sound right, you would need the reg info. If it looks used, there is no plastic protector on the LCD screens, has marks etc and you paid in full, take the required photos and get onto someone from where you purchased it. I wouldn't ever accept something second hand unless it was stated and the price reflected it.

 

Thanks, JesterMgee. Yeah, no plastic anywhere on the keyboard (screen or otherwise). Though the power cord and USB cable were plastic-wrapped (and interestingly, the plug came with adapters for different countries).

Here's the direct link to the photos:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/DjUdtWHdB37kFcrF6

One thing that is at least a bit reassuring: when I input the serial number (found on the bottom of the keyboard) into the Native Access program, it did activate all the expected downloads. Which (I hope) would suggest that this didn't have a prior owner. Additionally, it was shipped in a "Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88" box. Still, does seem strange to not see any leaflets in the box at all.

 

return it! if that were my situation, my OCD wouldn't have it any other way. you paid good money for a new product, so in return it should be new.

one thing i wish i knew before getting my S61 MK2 is that, i wish i knew i wasn't able to control any hardware synths without unplugging from the USB port. the S61 MK2 needs a AC plug for power, then i can use a standard MIDI cable to control other hardware synths, etc. if and when they make a MK3 version, hopefully they fix this problem, so you can use the USB, and the MIDI ports at the same time.

 

Yeah from the photos that is a return which is common as some wish to test a keyboard a bit first but whoever is in charge of returns is a bit lousy without even cleaning someones greasy chicken licking fingers off the thing unless that is residue from a cleaning product, then it's just as bad a cleaning job....

I'd be contacting someone with those photos, stating it is very poor form and can another be shipped out with a return postage label for your initial one OR some form of compensation to cover your time to clean that mess. I have personally bought gear that had marks from being second hand, mostly I accept some hands touch it but in cases where it is visually used like that example, missing parts in box and passed off as new at new price i'm straight back to the store/seller asking what they can do to fix this issue before I return it. Done in a nice way, you can normally be compensated for it.

 

wei wei, JestMgee, thanks! The thing that's puzzling is that this is that I bought it from a very trusted seller from a well-respected music company; he has long offered special corporate deals to my colleagues. So it's not like I bought this from a fly-by-night random internet site :-D.

QUESTION: If you recall by chance, were there stickers (e.g., "welcome to Native Instruments" or similar) around the wheels when you bought your NI keyboard? And/or protective film on the LCD screens? My theory is that this was a store demo model where they had removed stickers and LCD film like this before showcasing it.

And wei wei, while I don't have any current plans to control other hardware synths from this controller, that's still useful and important info to know; thanks for sharing!

 

My keyboard was purchased 5 odd years ago and contains an LCD strip, not screens, but typically the screens will always have protectors on them to prevent the plastic and manuals in the box from causing any small scratches. It is always the very first thing I check for when I purchase anything, if it's missing, it's been used.

Reputable or not, not every store has top level people working in every corner and I have sometimes purchased and returned gear that didn't fit my needs (cough, Akai Advanced...). However because I use to work in retail and in warehousing dealing with products and returns and having to clean this kind of thing up for resale, I always keep the plastic screen covers, bags, cable ties, manuals and stickers etc for the first few weeks in case I wish to return it so the store can easily box and resell. In your case, the box should have been labelled as "Open Box" with a discount to reflect that and last thing you want is a store demo model because they get abused a bit.

If it's all functioning fine and it's just some marks and a few non important things missing from the box it's your call really. Probably nothing to stress over, just tends to knock my trust in a seller down a few notches because it reflects a lack of care/attention.

 

It might have been a store demo, sometimes advertised as open box. Usually sold at a discounted price. If it was advertised as new, I'd either ask for a replacement, or if I'm satisfied with it's performance, a partial refund.