Akai Force!!!

Discussion in 'General Production Forum' started by Hit-Man, Jan 17, 2019.

  1. Hit-Man

    Hit-Man NI Product Owner

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    846
    The Force only has 16 tracks... :(
     
  2. Slappz

    Slappz NI Product Owner

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    Any other forum I might be hesitant to tell you to get lost hater, but seeing this is a music site I have no problems calling a Hitman out! o_O
    The Beatles only used four, so if over half a century later you can't get by with 16 ... then you might not be as good as they were, or you just might suck ... not you personally but for people in general. hahaha
    I personally never use over 16 tracks in my urban/dance projects.
     
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  3. loachm

    loachm NI Product Owner

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    2,062
    ...that pic just looks like a clip pattern. I may have overlooked something, but as of now I haven't found anything, that tells this thing will have a performance record mode or an Arranger (and will it have automation curves!?!!?? :eek::rolleyes:o_O:D:D:D). Currently it looks to me, as if it was just eight tracks of either audio or midi and a clip grid. It doesn't seem to load VSTis - it's most likely just the integrated instruments, that are almost definitely the engines of Air's Hybrid, Loom, Velvet & Tubesynth plus their effect suite. And then that's it.

    It seems to be like just the Session View of Live Lite (plus maybe eight additional tracks of audio, not sure) with integrated Air instruments and no VST-support. That is totally cool, if someone needs a reliable, solid piece of standalone gear for the stage. However, I'm quite certain, that this is not something for the majority of users here. But on the other hand to me it seems this thing will be used just yet another time to claim "Look NI, you're falling behind" (just as it has been with the Akai Fire), while it's most likely comparing apples and oranges. I could be wrong about my assumption on the Force, though, as I'm not sure, I have the full picture, yet.

    However, I have a hunch and that's why my first post here was rather meant as a joke, so I agree machinesworkinghardforyou ;)
     
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  4. Uwe303

    Uwe303 NI Product Owner

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    6,495
    I would like to see a counter software

    Uwe
     
  5. ScottK

    ScottK NI Product Owner

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    That could be quite limited given that it's marketed as a Performance tool, Once you build a drum kit that's half your tracks used, Unless you want to use the same drum kit for multiple songs then maybe not the best device for a live set unless it's part of a bigger setup.
     
  6. Slappz

    Slappz NI Product Owner

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    I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that I'm pretty sure they're the ones that invented virtual midi tracks back in 1980. You'll probably be limited to 16 audio tracks because of the memory constraints of a hardware device, but who knows you may be right.
     
  7. ScottK

    ScottK NI Product Owner

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    Just watched the Sweetwater you tube on this and a track can contain a full drum kit (More like a Maschine group)
    So not quite as limited as I first imagined.
    My next goal is to find out how much audio it can deal with and if no song mode if it will respond to program change.
     
  8. Slappz

    Slappz NI Product Owner

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    It would nice if you can also upgrade the memory in it.
     
  9. tempsperdu

    tempsperdu NI Product Owner

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    2,329
    For me this, the chip set and drive space (if they can't be upgraded) are the real drawbacks to stand alone devices.
     
  10. Uwe303

    Uwe303 NI Product Owner

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    6,495
    Same for me, that's another reason why I love maschine, I just upgraded my pc and have now much more power.

    Uwe
     
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  11. ScottK

    ScottK NI Product Owner

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    79
    I don't think drive space is a issue but chip set and memory might be limited to what is in it at point of purchase.
    That being said it could have a longer life span than your average laptop/pc as it's a deciated music device and os upgrades and plugin updates that require more cpu/memory eat into the lifespan of pc's/laptops.
    It would not replace my laptop but used along side my laptop it would free up cpu/memory on laptop.
    How much can be done on it and how hard it can be pushed v cost will decide if it will make it into my setup.
     
  12. omegatron

    omegatron NI Product Owner

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    A standalone unit will be running long after support for it has ended.. fact... Look at the sheer amount of ancient mpcs, synths etc out there all still churning out great tunes regardless of advances in technology, you can't write something of because it's not expandable, you have too embrace the available feature set and make the best use of it you can, I reckon in a few years if this format is successful and scalable that we'll be seeing some truly remarkable hardware releases across the board..
     
  13. morgendugg

    morgendugg NI Product Owner

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    Came across a video by a betatester on YouTube. In the comments the betatester said that an arranger is in betatest and he oped it would be finished for relese. And as we know that information is protected so Akai won't comment after made public. Looking forward to see if it contains performance recording.

    From the Ableton integration that is alredy promised, loading and saving Ableton projects, the logic leans towards the Ableton arranger.
     
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  14. daslicht

    daslicht NI Product Owner

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    396
    Now only more into depth information about the sampler engine is needed, does it support multisamples / keygroups as the mpc ? does it have filters etc ...
     
  15. freakydinde

    freakydinde NI Product Owner

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    what is the point about akai force ? it looks like a old school groovebox.. why would you go back in the 90's ??

    how can we use VST ? how can you edit audio without screen & mouse ?

    Push > Maschine > Force
     
  16. daslicht

    daslicht NI Product Owner

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    It has a Touch Screen ? I think it is for people who prefer a dedicated hardware unit over using a computer.
     
  17. AureVoir

    AureVoir NI Product Owner

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    I would like for Native Instruments to rise to Akai's challenge, I just don't think it likely. Akai has been putting out standalone devices for a while BEFORE Native Instruments was even a thing and I just feel that if it were a priority Native Instruments has had plenty of time to figure it out and roll out some standalone gear of their own. Instead, we get Maschine Mikro MK3 which is more of the same. Akai has released the MPC live and X, both standalone units, along with releasing software that in a fraction of the time, dare I say less than 4 years (about half the age of Maschine), has almost caught up with Maschine! I feel all NI can do at this point is stay in their lane. They make alright Midi Controllers and great plug-ins for them. They are probably closer to releasing a DAW then a standalone unit and even that would probably be delayed indefinitely if announced.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2019
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  18. Slappz

    Slappz NI Product Owner

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    This is where I get why NI might feel the need to stay in their lane. If you couple that with the fact that a lot of people would like to have a groovebox that is more like a PC than a Mac, then this is where NI is a godsend. I think at some point they need to test the waters with something small, but it could also be a huge mistake that cost us the missing software features. You know them having to chase down that watered down OS needed to run a standalone box

    If anything I would like to think that they were in a better position to bridge a standalone box to the PC/Mac. How much can something like a customized Windows embedded on those little micro computers cost, so you'd think they'd want to create their own customized piece of hardware that include their huge ecosystem. I actually think I might be on to something, so let me break it down for you.

    Native Instruments could provide a box for it's huge list of 3rd party developers. NI already has that structure in place where Akai would have to start to build a much closer relationship to some of the same vendors. That would mean that your NI box would more than likely come with more instruments out of the box, plus better support of the plugins in the box, plus so much more!
     
  19. omegatron

    omegatron NI Product Owner

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    I don't disagree fella, I think N.I. are way to far down the line to switch up what they're doing in the short term, and it's way too early to judge what kind of impact the force will have on the market place, I would absolutely love to see a portable untethered version of maschine at some point because I'm really enjoying the live in spite of its old school workflow, I'm not here to bash maschine or n.i. I stick around because the conversation is good and it's for the most part well informed and balanced, over on the MPC forums boards it can be a little combative and those guys really are hardcore MPC heads...

    I'm pretty confident if they really had an appetite for it that a standalone version of maschine could be produced that operated just like the MPC live/X, untethered the os would be stripped back offering the opportunity to work and produce away from the computer and then plug it all in to polish up your work on a desktop or laptop..

    Either way it's an exciting time to be involved in and I salute Akai for pushing the groove box format forward and hope that n.i. will someday offer something similar..
     
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  20. Slappz

    Slappz NI Product Owner

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    339
    I think this is where you nailed it, and NI has possibly slept on and missed a great opportunity. I think the flip side of it is that NI has a deeper and richer system on the computer since Maschine released in 2009, and the MPC software released in 2012. Akai is doing the right thing, but NI is shooting themselves in the foot by ignoring the big picture. A box with NI instruments in it would rule them all.

    They wouldn't even need to build a DAW and just look at something like Tracktion which just open-sourced it's DAW engine. That's a win for everybody because waveform is still being actively developed, and NI gets a DAW and song mode they so desperately need.

    I was actually even going so far as to actually thinking about asking them to let me build some prototypes, but I don't have that kind of money.

    Edit: Better yet just buy the Tracktion company and do what you like!
    https://www.tracktion.com/develop/tracktion-engine
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2019
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