Another Maschine Vst + Reaper thread (2014)

Allright guys,

I've been searching a lot on Cockos/reaper forum and here before deciding to create this thread. I did try the steps in this post : http://www.native-instruments.com/forum/threads/maschine-in-reaper-as-vst.141598/

No success so far. Here's what's happening at the moment with these following steps :

1. Open a fresh Reaper project and open Maschine in a new track and click 'No' when it asks if you want all outputs automatically set up.

2. Load some drums into a bank.

3. Go into sound Midi Batch Setup in the group menu and choose Sounds to Midi Notes. You can leave the root key set to C3.

4. Make sure the Maschine track is record armed and set to record input and moniter input and to recieve midi from all midi inputs.

----------------------
5: Now on the Maschine controller press the Control button while holding shift which will put it into midi mode, and then choose group E. You should now be able to hear your drum kit when you play the pads.

Here's where there's a problem. Whenever I switch to MIDI Control mode, "keyboard mode" activate and I can only hear 1 sound, played chromaticlly on my 16 pads.

Is this normal!? How can I play my kit normally like in maschine mode.

Thanks

 

Try setting your Group input channel and root note to the corresponding channel (i.e., the channel you have Maschine in MIDI mode transmitting on) and "root note" (pad 1) of MIDI mode.

MIDI batch setup is for transmitting MIDI out of Maschine in control mode (i.e., out of the Maschine plugin in your case).

 

Hi Mr36,

thanks for the quick reply

You got me confused a little. I thought midi mode and Controle mode were the same thing. And on the other side, you had the "maschine mode" which is the normal maschine like in Standalone. ?

Let's say i have the simplest setup : only 1 track in reaper (which has maschine as a vst). I'm assuming this track IS the channel on which Maschine will output the data. Right? See, i'm not so sure about which "direction" or path everything is supposed to be set. Like... when I press the pad, it's an "Input" coming for Maschine and then, Maschine "output" that same data to reaper? Therefore, do I need to bother about the Output section in maschine vst for my group or sound?

I also tried what you suggested. Here's the result WHEN IN "Maschine normal mode" : In input for group, if I leave "active" untick and Channel on "All", I get no midi data in my track when pressing Maschine pads (but I hear sound). HOWEVER, when playing my midi keyboard (hooked via usb directly in my PC), the MIDI notes record on my track and I hear sound. Only problem. it only record different pitch of the last sound that was selected on my maschine pads.

STILL IN maschine mode : In input for group, if I tick active, and select channel 1, I hear sound when pressing the pads. No midi data on my track when recording. When playing my midi keyboard, I DON'T hear sound but the data get's recorded. Upon playback I still don't hear sound (eventhough there's data in the track.
IF I change Channel back from 1 to ALL, it doesnt change anything.

I hope this ^ help to isolate the problem?

Ahhh also messing around with the root note (while "active" is ticked) DID give me back sound on my keyboard. And now I have my 16 drum sound on different piano keys. That's something! (Root note is on C2 btw)

 

Many (myself included) use "control mode" for when the Maschine controller is controlling the Maschine software directly and "MIDI mode" when it is a generic MIDI controller.

MIDI operates across 16 channels and it is this kind of channel I meant, not tracks in REAPER.

If you haven't changed anything from their defaults in Controller Editor, I think Maschine is set up to send on MIDI channel 1, so try setting up your Group MIDI input in the Maschine software to receive on MIDI channel 1.

 

MAGIC! I manage to record a few drum sounds on a reaper track using the pads while in "midi mode"
We're getting somewhere Mr36, Thank you very much. I still need your help though

ok so now what's going on is that only pad 1 to 4 output sounds (which is still better than before cause it's now 4 different sounds from my kit).
Do i need to do something with the root note thing in the Group Input?
My keyboard however has all 16 sounds and can record aswell on my track.

2) regarding the midi channels. What do I do when adding different groups? They should output on different channel normally (and on different reaper track) Yet it means there should be "sends" and "receive" involve in the procedure right? . To tell which track recieves what?!

 

Set the Group MIDI input root note as whatever note your pad 1 in MIDI mode sends. C3? C2?

Setting different Groups up to respond to different MIDI channels is one option. But then you need your MIDI mode MIDI to be on different MIDI channels. So you could set up different REAPER tracks (for the different Groups) with Maschine MIDI mode channel 1 as their inputs, but have them sending their MIDI to the Maschine plugin track on different MIDI channels (corresponding to the different Groups) as "sends" in REAPER's track io settings and to have only one of these tracks armed at a time.
Or you could record all your MIDI into one REAPER track (different from the Maschine plugin track) that sends its MIDI to Maschine and change either its send channel or the channel that MIDI mode is using.
Depends what you want and how you like to work really.

 

Allright!!! We're getting there! Now I have all my 16 sounds recording well in my reaper track. I had to change C2 to C3 to get all sound.
You spoke of the controller editor, indeed I went there and fool around a little bit which might explain why i'm not on C1 root note.

And in order for you to understand perfectly what i'm trying to achieve with my groups and all,
It's described there --- ) http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=108652

The video at 12min15 is the sweet spot

So he's got all 8 vertical button ("scene" all the way to "mute" to select 8 different track in reaper and arm it). He did that by assigning actions in reaper according to CC midi message. I got that part working, i can select 8 different track and also use the transport button on maschine to trigger transport actions in reaper (Play/stop/loop, etc).

So basically what i'm missing is the part where his 8 vertical button not only select a different track within reaper but also "magically" allow you to change between groups within maschine. So when track 1 is selected, group A automatically selects itself and he can trigger the sounds it contain.
When track 2 is selected, it's group B, etc.

Beauty of that is it seems to be a very quick workflow and you barely have to use the mouse... So yeah, that's what I'd really like to do.

i'm sorry if i'm asking much... I've replied to the thread on cockos and asked for help but no one came to help those past 10 days so.

What you think about that?

 

My initially thought about this was that the setup you describe is using a slightly older version of the Maschine plugin where MIDI input to a Sound/Group would auto,anti ally select that Sound/Group. I believe this was "fixed", as it was causing issues with users who had and wanted multiple streams of MIDI going to Maschine in a DAW. I, for one, wish they had just made this an option in preferences, as I have some use for such behaviour myself (not unlike what you want to do).
So as far as I know, this can't be done any more. Groups can only be selected with the Maschine controller in control mode or the mouse.
Need to,try this again though to make sure, but maybe someone else can pipe up if here is a way to do this.

 

Oooh man! that suck if the completely remove the option :S after all this time i've spent trying to figure it out..

Saintjoe also wrote me a quick response :
"Set the group inputs to different channels and setup a midi track for each group to match the midi channel you set for the groups."

Not 100% sure if this means it can work

 

I've since realised you might not have meant that you need the Group inside the Maschine software to become active and in focus, which is what my last response was about. If not and you just want the different Groups to be the ones that respond, you just need to choose one of the options for how you only have one REAPER MIDI track sending to Maschine at a time.

The method Saintjoe suggests is essentially the same as mine from above, I just went a bit further a blabbed about the next part: how you can differentiate the same input to be different Groups.
If you've got the vertical buttons to select 8 tracks in REAPER and record arm them, you can have those 8 tracks each receive MIDI from MIDI mode on the same channel, but transmit to the Maschine plugin on different channels and channels that correspond to the different Maschine Groups. You will have to record disarm the other tracks though, otherwise they will still receive and therefore play their respective Groups as well as the one you want to be playing. Make sense?

Clear as mud, I'm sure.

Basically:
Create 9 tracks in REAPER
Maschine in MIDI mode transmitting on channel 1 with those buttons selecting and record arming tracks 1-8
Maschine plugin on track 9 with 8 Groups each with their MIDI input set to different channels (1-8, respectively)
Track 1 set to receive on channel 1 and transmit its MIDI to track 9 (Maschine plugin) on channel 1 for Group A
Track 2 set to receive on channel 1 and transmit its MIDI to track 9 (Maschine plugin) on channel 2 for Group B
Track 3 set to receive on channel 1 and transmit its MIDI to track 9 (Maschine plugin) on channel 3 for Group C
Track 4 set to receive on channel 1 and transmit its MIDI to track 9 (Maschine plugin) on channel 4 for Group D
Track 5 set to receive on channel 1 and transmit its MIDI to track 9 (Maschine plugin) on channel 5 for Group E
Track 6 set to receive on channel 1 and transmit its MIDI to track 9 (Maschine plugin) on channel 6 for Group F
Track 7 set to receive on channel 1 and transmit its MIDI to track 9 (Maschine plugin) on channel 7 for Group G
Track 8 set to receive on channel 1 and transmit its MIDI to track 9 (Maschine plugin) on channel 8 for Group H

 

Okay, Fiewww for a min, i thought everything was lost ^.^
I'm gonna try your setup tonight and report back

Not sure though when you say transmit, we're talking about the reaper track - clicking on I/O , and then it's the "sends" section . correct? sorry if this is a noob question.. i'm obviously pretty new at this, and self thaught with the help of good samaritans (like you!)

So in reaper, track 1 recieve FROM track 9, channel 1, ALL midi data, and also sends midi on channel 1.

and So on for the others.

 

Transmit = send, yes. And in the REAPER part, yes "send" in the io window. But no, not MIDI from track 9 (your Maschine track), MIDI to (transmitted to, sent to) track 9 from each of the 8 input tracks.

 

Last part I want to make sure :
" Maschine in MIDI mode transmitting on channel 1 with those buttons selecting and record arming tracks 1-8"

You're basically talking about going to track 9 in reaper, clicking I/O, and choosing a SEND on channel 1 (though where would I "send", on my 8 different tracks ?!

 

No. That statement says "Maschine in MIDI mode" (i.e., the Maschine controller in MIDI mode, configurable through Controller Editor) is transmitting/sending its MIDI (i.e., when you press a button or a pad in MIDI mode, it is transmitting/sending a message on 1 of 16 MIDI channels) on channel 1 to REAPER (i.e., the 8 tracks in REAPER set up to receive channel 1 from Maschine in MIDI mode and the buttons assigned to the actions you referred to previously to select the tracks and arm them).

Make sense?

Maschine in MIDI mode on channel 1 (verify in Controller Editor)
Assign buttons to actions
Set up 8 tracks to receive Maschine MIDI on channel 1

No offence is meant by this comment: Maybe looking up some of the fundamentals of MIDI would help you to understand and to work out what you want to do.
It would certainly make it easier for me to explain stuff.

 

No offense taken
You're right that i'm making it complicated for you eheh but I appreciate your effort (i'm sure others out there will if they come here searching for a similiar problem) To be honest, i'm also looking at the manuel and doing parallel reading on midi but it's just huge to take all at once. Specially if your a visual person like me and need to DO IT to really see it.

anyhow, yes your last post do make sens now. I didn't know it was in the controller editor i could "set that up". Well, actually it was alrdy on channel 1, so i'm not sure if I had to set it up or do something. (see the attached screenshot). So on that end (maschine transmitting on 1), I think we're good?

Now in reaper : what exactly do i need to do to make the 8 tracks recieve midi from maschine like you say?

I should of thought about that sooner (speaking of being a visual person) but i have a feeling it will be MUCH MORE easy for you to see what's going and tell me if everything's set to be allright. Please see the attached screenshot and feel from to indicate me something according to a specific ss (I named differently for that purpose).

 

You need to activate the Maschine MIDI input in preferences (MIDI devices) and then you can select the Maschine MIDI controller on channel 1 when you arm each of the 8 tracks.

(I can't really verify from your screenshots, as they're too small and/or low res for me to see your actual settings, particular on the REAPER side of things.)

When you've done the above, does it work? That's the test of whether you've set it up properly.

And I said Maschine in MIDI mode was probably on channel 1 by default, so you wouldn't have had to do anything. But good that you checked and now know that's where you go to change it.

 

ahh mybad for those screenshots, it's my new 2 screen setup that splits the ss kinda in half the size and resolution.
Fixed it now. You should be able to see into more details

And no, it still doesnt work where I can change group by changing track.
What works is I have a complete kit working fine (kit A on track 1) that I can record and see the data on my reaper track (track #1)
I can select another track (track #2) , and record on it. i see the data i.e. midi notes being recorded on that track aswell. but it's the same sounds (Kit A)
it's the same thing for all the tracks. Also if that helps you, when I go into maschine Vst, with my mouse. I can click on any group and sound and only ONE sound is triggered : that is the pad #1 of my first group (the kick)

ahhhh I know we're close of finding the solution!!

 

You haven't set the MIDI sends from each of the 8 tracks to "translate" the incoming MIDI on channel 1 (i.e., from your Maschine controller in MIDI mode) to the channels of each Group. Where it says MIDI "all to all", that needs to be "1 to 1" for track 1, "1 to 2" for track 2, "1 to 3" for track 3 ... "1 to 8" for track 8.

 

OOOOH YESSS!!!! Now it's working
wewwww ! Gracias VERY MUCH Mr 36 !!!!
I'm gonna mess around a little bit with it, try to digest all the info and come back to comment, possibly do a step by step tutorial with screenshot to help out others!
Oh yeah, one more thing i'd like to do (that is pretty important in the equation) is add and external midi keyboard
Don't know how this would work but I'd like to select my sound with Maschine, and for those melodic one, like a bass, or flute or whatever,
be able to play different note of that same sound with my midi keyboard .

Than use maschine to navigate to a different group (using vertical buttons) and using the pads to select a sound. Then play it with the keyboard.

Possible?!

 

Well, you have another 8 MIDI channels to use with that current setup and you can set individual Sounds to receive and respond to specific MIDI channels, so...