Beatport is an *rse Pt 2

Felix Da Housecat Mix Competition Rules;-

"Computer-sequenced mixes will not be accepted. You must perform and control your mix in real-time, as would be expected from any professional DJ. Laptop-based software such as Traktor Scratch or Serato is fine, as long as you are performing mixes and beat-matching in real-time".

Does this maen you can or can't use the sync button?

What about the Ableton dudes?

Does this not seem totally ridiculous for a Digital Music distributer?

Or am I just a grumpy old fart?

 

Ableton has been ruled out... They don't mention the sync button either, but they do say you have to match by ear, so... Yeah, one could only infer that that would mean no...

And yeah, Before Steveboy ripped the Beatport people, they had it listed that no software at all was allowed...

I think it is rather that Beatport especially would condone this, but eh... What the hell can you do?

:lol:
:lol:
:lol:

 

You can use dedicated DJ software in the contest now. The qualifying criterion is that you have to be able to mix it live.

 

Seems bizarrely 'old skool' from Beatport.com...

The skill of beatmatching by ear is becoming more irrelevant in this digital age.

 

Mr. Podrunner, WTF?

Have you ever seen an I-pod run?

Transformers the movie... Good stuff...

You should see the DVD case for the DVD, it transforms!

Pretty wild...

Anywho, I guess I'll check out those rules again...

I think the two-three year experience thing would rule me and my buddy Jonnie out of this anyhow, but yeah, right now, the homefront needs the Captain to man the ship...

Waters have been rather calm lately, but that's just what happens before the storm... Always seems to have perfect timing... :|

 

Okay, I'll admit I didn't really follow this.

 

Just one of those moments brother...

I did see the rules again, they ask for experience in clubs or parties... s**t... I play parties for myself all the time... I've even had an audience a few times! And once or twice, I actually left a place with $ for my services!

That was cool...


Anyhow, I won't be entereing.

I just wanted to comment on this all and raise my posts!

 

I bet most of the people who would want to enter would be excluded because of the experience requirement.

"Thanks for buying all those tracks from BeatPort for the last 3 years - but no - you can't enter this competition. That "pro DJ " from the local dive bar who has never heard of beatmatching or Felix Da Housecat - he is allowed to enter."

 

Hi,
I fully agree with you. Why the hell I can not prepare a perfect mix? I think, there is not a person on a planet that would be satisfied with one-shot mixed 75min. set, done on a shitty mixer and turntables.. Why the hell we buy all the digital stuff? Do we have to downgrade when it comes to mixing to show what we have got to our fingers?
Peter
PS: I use TDJS 3 + controllers

 

At the risk of getting flamed :| - I think the point here is that these guys ARE looking for a one shot 30 min mix put down using traditional turntable techniques (hence the Serato/Traktor scratch provision as you need to be able to beatmatch to use that kind of interface). They don't say anything about not being able to play anything you have dl'd from beatport over the last three years (or anywhere else for that matter). I doubt that they are looking for a perfect mix, more likely a well rounded mix with good progression put down on the fly and showing that you can handle problems/slides as and when they occur. Studio programming the perfect mix is all very well for the producer-types out there but if you spend three weeks putting that together but fall apart when the crowd reacts badly to your "perfect" mix and you can't adapt on the fly you are screwed!

I would also hazard that the minimum djing time requirement is so that they are more likely to get good quality mixes from dj's who have played out and have the experience they are looking for to warm up for one of the biggest and longest serving dj's on the planet without getting all nervous and screwing things up.

So what you going to do when something in your digital rig fails and you are left standing there in front of your crowd without Traktor? Do you carry some of your current tunes on cd as a back up? If so then you are going to have to know how to beatmatch mate.

Sorry if I sound a bit puritanical but there's no point in getting upset with a dj/producer looking to find a good talent by setting some pretty specific parameters to their competition - I'm more upset this is open to US dj's only

 

Until someone invents a crashproof laptop, OS and software, I will always carry a handful of CDs or vinyl *just in case* it all goes horribly wrong. And yes, I can beatmatch (having used vinyl / CD for longer than I have Traktor).

My point about the increasing irrelevance of beatmatching as a skill refers to the fact that with the proliferation of software like Ableton and Traktor, the actual skill of beatmatching is being rendered unnecessary as the software can do it better than you ever could.

This leaves the DJ free to explore musical avenues he/she would otherwise may not have had time to explore: more decks, samples, loops, fx etc etc.

Quoting from Sean's original post (in turn quoted from Beatport): "Computer-sequenced mixes will not be accepted. You must perform and control your mix in real-time, as would be expected from any professional DJ. Laptop-based software such as Traktor Scratch or Serato is fine, as long as you are performing mixes and beat-matching in real-time".

In my opinion, the phrase "You must perform and control your mix in real-time" applies equally to DJ's who use software to beatmatch and those who do it by ear. Just cos I use Traktor does not mean I have pre-planned a mix any more so than a vinyl jock.

I know plenty of vinyl jocks who planned their mixes to the point of jotting down the pitch slider positions for each transition!

Is the Beatport comp a 'live' event at a venue or simply submit a CD / MP3 file? Cos unless there is a 'live' element to the competition, everyone who enters a mix will have planned, practiced and executed their mix until they have reached perfection - regardless of what medium their music is in and what hardware platform they are working on. Making the whole "beat-matching in real-time" even more difficult to understand...

 

Yes, but one reason I complained and am happy they changed the rules is that there's no reason you can't do this with software. I've got 86 Podrunner mixes and about 40 Groovelectric mixes online; they're immensely popular, and every one of them was a one-shot. Laptop DJing has a toehold but it still needs all the cred it can get, and my rule is that if I can't play it straight live, it doesn't go out.

That said, if my laptop fails, I *am* screwed, because I never learned to use TTs or CDJs. I'm not trying to argue for my limitations here. I know how to beatmatch, I know how to work a room. I've elected to use a certain path to do it. To me the obvious advantage TT DJs have is reliability: while I've seen signal paths screw up, I've never seen a turntable just plain fail, and they'll work in conditions laptops won't.

 

I agree with everything in your post! I have completely different reasons for not entering (besides the fact that I'm not really a contest kinda guy) no matter what the rules are: I think it's kind of unseemly for a professional DJ -- especially one with active club experience, as they are suggesting -- to enter a contest to open for somebody. I know it's hard to get attention and opportunities should be seized, but I'm still uncomfortable with the idea of essentially acting like an amateur seeking some kind of employment opportunity. Just my opinion.

 

Exactly the same as I'd do if my turntables failed if I was a vinyl DJ, or if my CD players failed if I was a CD DJ.

I know this is going off on a tangent from the discussion, but I get this all the time & it annoys me! ...."what do you do if your computer crashes?".

You never hear a CD DJ having to justify what he'd do if the fuse went on his CD player.

Before you ask, I do have a back up plan. There's always an iPod or a back up CD cued up, & I carry a 2nd laptop.

 

The rules may seem bogus but to a certain degree the rules may actually be saving the newb and small event DJ's from themselves. Felix has has built his brand based on a polished performance. He wants and expects a DJ to warmup for him that can deliver the kind of performance his punters expect. He wants someone that really puts on a show, and it aint just about spinning a few tunes and having a few laughs.
The mixing part I think while it seems bogus is all about weeding out "press n go" DJ's It seems extreme but not all competitions are ever going to be for all DJ's to enter, this is one case. It sux but it is what it is.... and I doubt the rules are set by beatport. It doesn't halp that no one there had the balls to stand up say "hang on a sec...we're promoting this but the rules as written lock out a huge portion of the beatport community"....

Phil

Phil

 

DJ_AS & Boysteve, you make some really valid points - I was just trying to play a bit of devil's advocate for why the competition organisers may have placed the restrictions they have on the comp; also I don't want you to think that I was directing comments like "you have to be able to beatmatch" specifically at you, I'll bet there are quite a few traktor dj's out there who just hit the synch button and go with it.

I will stick by what I said about planning sets when you are playing out though, if you plan a set then you'll be locked into the set in your mind and if it doesn't pan out how you hoped it can be really hard to adjust. I'd say you're not really giving your creative juices the opportunity to flow that well either! Myself, I never plan sets when playing out, they're like a strategy for battle and usually go out the window by the third track (or pint).

So yep, TT's will work under many conditions where a laptop would give up and die but one of the reason my djing partner and I have ditched vinyl is the bouncy stage they have in the club we play in mostly - try playing vinyl with 20 people jumping up and down about 3 feet in front of you, I've even had a cdj skip on me with the bloody flat-footers .

Don't want you to think I am down on traktor djing either, I'm using a VCI-100 with traktor and occasional cd's so i would be excluded from this competition too. I love the versatility of traktor, being able to set loops and use effects all in one piece of software without heaps of equipment to set up and carry around - oh, and 100gb of mp3's weigh's so much less than 60 pieces of vinyl. My closest friend and mate I started djing with in 1997 has recently got serato (I'll wash my mouth out ) and says it is great but then he doesn't have onboard effects etc to use - one of the reason i crossed to traktor is because playing just two or three decks can get boring - havign all the other bits is so much more entertaining - it is a shame they may have missed that point in deciding the rules.

Anyhoo, opinions and thoughts, that's what we're here for

 

You don't have to justify using Traktor to *me*, of all people! I've only ever used Traktor to DJ, and I'm enjoying huge success with it (albeit in my own peculiar way).

And I agree totally about planning sets. I never plan mine; even if it's right for the room, spontaneity goes right out the window. I usually put together a list of tracks I think will be right for the room (sometimes as few as 20, sometimes as many as 80), and where I'd like to start. I feel perfectly free to ditch any of that, and usually I do. The room tells you what to play, if you're paying attention. And if you ain't, in my opinion you shouldn't be playing the room.

Phil: Beatport has pretty much said outright that Felix determined the rules. I just think the rules were fuzzy, and that the ability to clearly determine the criteria they're asking for is only going to get hazier. "You should be able to take separate tracks and mix them on the fly in a live setting" should be explicitly stated.

 

My experience has always been that practiced sets never get better or more spontaneous than their first play. My mixes, for better or worse, are always a product of just hitting record and doing a one shot recording. They aren't a product of any post production (or joining together) other than a bit of BBE and Wave Hammer in Sound Forge. If its good enough to give away I do, if not, I'll practice to fix why it wasn't good enough.

I'll start off with anything from 3 or 5 tracks to 20 or so. By Track 5 I've often (almost always) veered off and almost inevitably I won't play all the tracks I've chosen if there is a lot in the list. For me, its all about feeling it and if I don't I change what I play.

For the comp the rules were fuzzy to us. Maybe not to Felix, but hey its his house and his rules, I'm not about to beat up on him for requiring it to be live mixed comp when the prize is the chance to open for him. That he requires that only DJ's with plenty of proveable club experience can enter seems exclusionist, but once again I can understand and accept his rules / reasoning. I not about to enter the comp, but I'm not going to berate him for setting the rules as he did either.

Phil

 

I should amend my previous post to clarify that I *do* work from a playlist for Podrunner, because the mixes require that there be no downtime and I loop kicks behind all breaks, so there's definitely some planning necessary. But I still mix them straight live, and the only post is normalizing.

Beyond some broad sense of mood or casing the room, though, when I play out I pretty much wing it.