Beta impressions, the good, the bad and the ugly

Good:

It seems like the stability is as good as the previous version, no crashes, no audio artifacts that I've noticed (I did notice at least one user on the forum had experienced buggy output and worsened latency - though I expect this to be caused by choosing a wrong output driver).

Also, the keylock algorithm sounds somewhat better, though I must admit that so far I haven't had the opportunity to test the application under timecode control.

Bad:

The master clock tempo fluctuation still exists, and if you happen to have sync on the master deck, rapidly pressing CUE makes that deck even lock to the fluctuating tempo. For some reason, the tempo change is not reflected by the pitch-fader. I've reported this as a bug on the beta tracker.

Edit: Now that I've gone back to 1.1.2, it seems like this happens there also. This only increases my view that the sync's "intermediate/waiting"-state was a bad idea from the beginning.

Ugly:

The button interaction modes Hold/Toggle in MIDI setup work exactly the opposite to previous version. Manually changing the settings (changing every "Hold" to "Toggle and vice versa) helps a bit, but due to other features accompanied by these interaction modes, my mappings still don't work exactly like they did previously (mainly because the buttons in "Toggle"-mode respond to both keypress- and keyup-events). This bug has also been reported by me on the beta tracker.

Edit:

I was originally (in case the version proved stabile enough) intending to do the same thing UltraSniffy threatened (even though we're only expecting to have between 400 and 600 partygoers) but I think I'll stick with 1.1.2 for a while still

 

1. the pops and clicks seem to be a little bit better, thought not completely resolved when using control vinyl.:angry:
2. The four FX banks is the "Ish" Got three in chained mode ( 3rd bank is empty for now), one in advanced mode running the Delay ( this is sick for breakdowns). I also like the peak and format filters.
3. My midi map was still in place (Korg Nano-Kontrol), had to make a few adjustments for the two additional FX banks, but otherwise everything else is on point.

I would say that there still needs to be some work done on the popping and clicking issue. Seems that everyone is having this problem regardless of platform ( mac or pc)

 

+100 and check the key-lock-voice-drag please!

 

Aha, that would explain the serious issues I saw with the DJTT mapping. I guess I will install 1.2 on my spare laptop and give it a whirl once more, to see if indeed this is the issue. I presume this is not an intended change?

 

I'd be ready to bet my money on that assumption.

I presume you are correct. Most likely just a brainfart while checking the combobox's (geektalk for "select-element") selectedindex-value. Has happened to me a million times while coding. Very easy to fix once you find where it goes wrong.

 

Loved that: brainfart while checking the combobox xD

 

I cannot confirm your issue. Hold seems to hold and toggle seems to toggle. Ean's TSI is quite complex, but I tried validating that the import worked fine and I did not notice any issues. Still no clue whats going on.

 

I have issues with the interaction modes as well. I'm pretty sure something is buggy there, at least it doesn't work reliable

 

do you mean the same as you posted in the other thread about tempo fluctuations?
please note my answer!

if so... this is not a bug. if you are constantly resetting the master tempo (what you do if you click on cue/play) on the MASTER DECK then this is expected. put the master clock on INT and the deck will follow the master clock (which is not affected by your cue/play clicking).

 

So you mean that the master deck should lock to the tempo that is random? And stay at that? If so, this is a very lousy feature.

To make it even more clear; I don't need to do it constantly. Even one time is enough. If I have the master clock set to auto, have no tracks playing and I start a track, the master tempo might fluctuate to somewhere around +20% and *stay there* because the automation sets the track as master only at that point, sees that "ok, this track should be playing @ +20%" and not think about it further. That definitely counts as a bug in my books.

Another example ... if my track is 128 BPM, I want it to be 128 BPM when I press PLAY and not "something between 115 BPM and 135 BPM", which it currently might end up being due to the bug.

Do try it in beta. If you have access to the bug tracker, very easily (on my opinion) followable steps to reproduce the problem are there. What I consider a bug, I consider a bug and I damn well report it as one - no matter what anyone else says. This is not exactly the same problem what was discussed in the earlier thread, but on some level I believe these things are very much connected - and on many levels this is a lot worse problem (though I think it only affects internal playback, because ... well - timecode control is timecode control).

Edit: What I believe is happening is the execution order of code is wrong; on my opinion, before the master clock has decided what the clock source is, it should not tamper with any deck's tempo (because otherwise it will end doing what it does now - changing the tempo of the deck that in the next step of execution becomes the master deck).

 

SET.THE.MASTER.CLOCK.TO.INT.IF.THE.MASTER.CLOCK.SHOULD.BE.THE.MASTER.

if set to auto, it follows the deck.

and your clicking is obviously not super exact.

i dont know in how many different words i should put this. i reassured with NI that i'm not misunderstanding.

 

You obviously are missing the point. I'm not talking of the previous problem, this is a new one.

If my track is @ 128BPM, pitch @ 0% and I press Play, the track should not change to 132 BPM, pitch @ 0% before starting playback (or if it does, it should bloody well get back to 128, but it doesn't).

In case I haven't already made this clear; I don't want the master clock to be the master. I want the deck to be the master. Still, TSP syncs to master clock just before setting the deck as master ... which pretty much nulls the idea of having the deck as master.

 

I appreciate your reassurance. Could you please tell me why this works differently in 1.2 beta than it did on 1.1.2 (see the attached video for details).

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQb5LaFJWAE"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQb5LaFJWAE[/ame]

Edit: It seems like the audio track is once again bit out of sync towards the end, but the problem should be pretty obvious anyway...

 

sry kid, but i can't really get much of anything from ur vid. sure i see a tempo fluctuation near the end of the clip, but w/o knowing ur settings i can't tell what the problem may be. personally i tend to think native girl is on the money with this one...pure operator error, but i really just can't tell for certain.

question, y do u keep cueing the track over and over? is this typical of ur mixing style? ur using scratch pro, but show no gear outside of a nanoPAD...nothing in ur sig. does the tempo fluc throughout playback? does it hold a erroneous tempo reading?

anyhoo, in keeping with the topic:

THE GOOD:

GREAT new features, crisp audio, massive improvement in keylock...still more to find i'm sure. mixes and scratches like a champ, monitored via 2500watt soundsystem so i'm quite certain of the sound quality.

THE BAD:

cannot MIDI assign my nanoPAD buttons...thus keeping me from really getting into the new MIDI CONTROLLER menu. while the new FX sound very nice, i can't yet get into the type of performance i require/desire to fully assess them.

THE UGLY:

i just bought the nanoPAD a few weeks ago...it doesn't like feeling useless. would really like to assign the new FX, but my zero4 lacks buttons and TOGGLE interaction is AWOL. watching for an update for this like a hawk!

 

I made a video of pratically the same thing here.

http://www.native-instruments.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90616

 

whats the purpose of pressing play over and over while in master?

 

There isnt one....the reason behind the video is that when you load a deck the BPM value also changes upon loading the track and when you are about to play the track and it shouldn't. The pressing play on and off is just to show that this is happening not necessarily showing that this is what you are going to do before you actually play the Master track.

 

OK yeah, i see it jumps...but how about when the track continues to play. does the BPM hold an erroneous reading? because if it corrects itself then i don't see a problem.

sry, but i don't click buttons to play tracks...with tables we always see the BPM flux upon startup...that's why we sometimes pitchbend slightly to match. thankfully years of scratch practice helps me to cue near perfectly...but hey, dropping cuts on beat is practically all we do.

here's a fact. timecode vinyl will practically always fluctuate during playback...the little BPM number bounces around, that's just how turntables are.

maybe that's why i fail to understand...?

again sry, not trying to be a jerk (i know) but only a screenshot video doesn't tell us what the problem is...and for a majority of us (DVS users anyhow), whether or not there's truly a problem at all. srsly, do you guys constantly tap the play button to cue your tracks? or is that just to "demonstrate" your [ahem] "issue".

if you're telling me you play a 130bpm track and the readout locks at 128...then say it pls. if you want to do video, record a 5-10 minute mix with this issue causing problems during the mix. real time. show us it doesn't perform.

[it's like i make a video of me tapping my nikes on the ground and saying "see that! see that! see that! i can't possibly run in these shoes!]

here's a tip though...don't assign a non-playing deck as master and let a playing deck be in sync-mode. (can this even happen?)

anyhow, if there is a problem i hope they fix it for you.

 

Your not being a jerk Sinjintek...but what I am talking about is if you dont want to use CDJs or Tables. I know I can work around it but I just would like to know if this is usual. That is all.

If I am going to jump on after a DJ that has played before me and I want to get synced up with what he is playing and I press pause on my master deck after I got my deck beat matched with his last track and then hit play again to get a mix going the BPM changes again automatically for no reason once I hit play again, is that a better explanation. Again this is not suppose to be a video of a guy pressing play/stop over and over to watch the BPM value change.

 

if you want to sync to another dj set clock master to internal tap bpm get a read out and sync thats what i do works perfect