Discussion starter, why on earth is anyone using timecode?

Hi there everyone.

I'm not intending to start pissing on some other users lawn here, but I have a serious question that I can't get out of my head. (I'm sincere, I do not intend to flame anyone)



Why are so many users using traktor with timecode?


Why are people using analouge equipment to run traktor? Why not go full digital and just carry your laptop, soundcard and midi-controller to a gig?
You kinda loose half of the idea when using traktor with timecodes and an external mixer in my opinion - a ton to carry with you (if the designated club/gig got poor equipment), basically no use for all of traktor's cool effects, loops and beat jumping functions and manual pitch control (yea, the sync-function saves you a TON of time to do other cool stuff when looked over a longer perspective)

Have I missed something cruical?

 

Yep, dj background.
What I mean is how some people first started djing, for a lot it was turntables or even cd decks.
For them, it's about having the best of both worlds, the feel of analog which allows them to play the way they are used to, plus the extra features that digital has to offer.

 

Ask a painter why he uses paint and not Photoshop.

Both produce amazing art, both are valid and are personal to the style of the artist.

If your just thinking about the carrying of gear then you are completely missing the point of using vinyl.
Its not any more clever using vinyl but some people learnt to DJ that way (me) and they continue to love the feel of using records.

And its way more cool , gets you more girls and other men wish they were you.



Oh and let me add right here autonic is asking a polite inquiring question. You vinyl boys go easy on him.
The last time this was asked limbs were lost so play nice..!

 

That pretty much killed the discussion lol

 

Okay... so it's all about the feeling from what I understand....

I started out with CD's about 10 years ago and sure, the feeling isn't the same using pure midi. However, I prefer the outstanding functionality using traktor and the tons of cool stuff you can do with a 100% midi-setup (and of course the extremley light weight setup compared to CD's or Vinyl).

I guess that there is nothing else to discuss here then.

 

It also depends on the style/genre of music.
Ive just got myself booked for a series Summer Barbecues and im gonna be playing funk,jazz,breaks all that sorta stuff so i wanna use my timecode setup cus i wont be using many effects or crazy 4 deck looping business.
I guess if i was playing something else more electronic that required a lot of looping and effects id go for a controller setup so i could concentrate (as you have said) on messing with the features .

Different music , different setup. Same result - People dancing !

 

Yea, it's all about people dancing, no way is better than what works

 

Ultimately if you do not use a timecode device you are not in fact beat-matching. If you have multiple layers of music and live elements then kudos, I'm impressed.

If, on the other hand, you are on stage mixing records which automatically match up to one another then you are essentially using the "airplane map your set mode ahead of the show" while actually at the show.

I mean no disrespect either. 10 years (or more) ago when I learned to dj if you could not match a beat you did not dj. Simple. It made it something halfway difficult and it required a certain amount of skill.

Unfortunately we are moving towards, in some cases, individuals mixing 1-4 simple techno beat layers auto-sync and really thinking they are on to something cool and difficult. It may sound great, but the fact is my nephew (10) could learn to do that. That is why lots of us old geezers stick to our vinyl and get into production/live PA. If you are doing 10 things at once then sure, autosync some records. IF you are just doing a 2-4 table set I'd much rather see some sort of timecode on board, otherwise you're clicking on-off on the puter and playing with knobs. That's just less to enjoy, IMO.

And yeah, it feels facking siiiick to grab the wax and make it happen.
Nothing else quite hits it... For some of us anyway.

Electronic music does lend more to extras/filters/effects/etc. The idea is to get beat matching down and then hit the effects. The speed at which you could match the two and start playing separated a lot of half-a$$ sets from the very interesting ones, back in the "day" at least.

 

I totally agree with you there - a DJ needs to be able to beat-match two songs by ear.

I think that it is almost as important today as it were during the pre-digital era. Why, you ask?

It's simple - everything you do as a DJ has to be on beat.
Sure the SYNC and QUANTINIZE makes things a lot easier when it comes down to just aligning the two beats pretty close to each other.
But there is still the issue of fine-tuning (needed pretty often even with sync and quantinize on, to get that rock solid beat match, since your beatgrids never will be EXACTLY at the same frequency/wavelength on all songs).
Then there are the effects... sure a filter won't sound like a bag of dog **** if you throw it in on the 3,5 beat of a phrase.... nor will the flanger... but the beatmasher, gater and delay might.

And now we are not even talking about those songs where the beatgrid is incorrect, for instace "Ali Payami & Warp Brothers - Blade"... during the end of the song the beat grid goes to **** for some reason, which would mean that such a song can't be mixed at all by someone handicapped by the sync-function. And then we are not even talking about all the older songs that almost never has a correct beat grid.


I think the evolution will continue in the way it always has been moving ahead - the ones famous will be the ones taking the current technology to the max.

Today's standard are 3 hotcues, one effect at a time and one hours per night looking for CD's and beat matching.
Tomorrow has 8 houtcues, 4 decks, 6 effects simultaneously, and practically zero time beat matching and searching music.

 

Who has time to add beatmarkers to my 12000+ song library? Plus actually knowing how to beatmatch is a good backup plan..

 

Show me one MIDI controller that you can scratch with as well as CDJs or vinyl.

 

How about Numark NS 7 and Stanton SCS 1d, though not actually available just yet.

 

Turntables are a more musical and physically engaging way to control music (for me at least).

Additionally, people like to see the dj busy working the party. I'm an open format dj so I'm only doing long blends about 40% of the night. The rest of the time I'm cutting or scratching in my tracks. Turntables (or cdjs) are pretty essential for this.

Plus rotating platters just look cool

 

Odd software behavior can be as difficult to master as the classic beatmatching paradigm. Reasoning why i think that traktor is 100% authentic.

 

Agree. Sometimes I play in bars (70's soul/funk, 80's rock and modern pop tunes), and I dont think anyone would fancy loops and/or effects in there.
Just as often I play in clubs (minimal to techhouse) where the loops and effects are essential to the groove and I think the less I have to worry about beatmatching, the more flow I will get on the whole experience.

So far not playing from computer, but Im soon there (I hope) and I will go both ways depending on the gig.

 

but artists don't use photoshop and try and control it with a brush on a canvas ...

Either embrace digital and go with all it offers you (and accept its limitations) or stick with decks and vinyl and the warmth of the analogue world.
Trying to mix the two seems a bit daft - like getting a nice shiny new motorbike and insisting it has pedals and a nice wicker basket on the front.

 

Nah your misreading me. Ill be clearer.

I like to draw. Ill sketch anything, make a pretty picture with a pencil and if it looks good ill stick it on the fridge.

I also design flyers for people and ive done a few magzine adverts as well. I use Photoshop and Illustrator. I also stick them on the fridge.

2 different mediums - same result - a pretty picture of a cat

You dont have to stick to one thing or the other.
I know people hate the Traktor Pro videos but why do you think they have Richie Hawtin and GMFlash on them. 2 different DJs , 2 different styles of music and 2 different ways of using the software (when Hawtin is using his controller setup)

I dont think the motorbike analogy works at all.
I also think its a bit narrow minded to think that you shouldnt mix technology with tradition.


Also : artists use graphic tablets which is digital painting. Touche

 

That reminds me of one guy who insisted that timecode sounded "warmer" than MIDI. You know. Playing the same file and stuff.
I wonder what color his thong was.

 

Hahaha Midi has a better 'aura' than timecode. Although Timecode has better 'Karma'.

Bonkers

 

I did a series about five years ago that was all pencll drawings done in layers. As if I was working on acetate or velum. Instead of doing some sort of multi-plate print.. which is a dirty and un-healthy process I decided to do a more digital application by scanning all the layers and then assembling them in photoshop. This allowed me greater layer control and enhanced complexity....and in the end the final products were something that could have never been achieved with analogue technologey.

When Im thinking about mixing records I am often thinking about painting, layers, and transparency. Most of my visual work conceptually denotes some sort of mapping, organization, or systemic cooperation... much like mix composition.

A great advantage that digital medium has over pencil, canvas and brush.. the ability to go backwards ... is so important for me... fixing mistakes and or adding content to buried layers is only possible in the digital medium. buttt,,, the digital tools for idea development and mark-making ... are somewhat limited. I feel that combination of the two is very important for me.

considering the resolution of the controllers time-code is warmer and more..... hmmmm... two eggs/ over hard, link sausage and hashbrowns..