Exploring sync

Hi,
I was exploring sync possibilities in reaktor, and even if I managed to get the standard sync sound using 2 oscillators, I've faced some difficulties implementing keyboard follow and soft sync.

I've also read about reverse sync or some other sync possibilities that I would have liked to test if interesting.

I tried to pick up some oscillators with sync to see how it's made. I found this interesting ensemble by Dustin Mosley which has all the features I'm expecting. (find it here https://co.native-instruments.com/index.php?id=userlibrary&type=0&ulbr=1&plview=detail&patchid=9175)

So I went into it. And got most of it except one thing : the soft sync part :/
(maybe that explains why I failed previously)

The part I don't get is the mixer with this 680 value for level (huh?) (and I guess this -1 mixed at 0 is useless...) and that goes into a clipper before being multyplied with the rest of the FM mods.
I don't get all this, neither the reason why. What kind of soft sync is it?

And in the end I must say that I think I'm a bit disapointed by sync in reaktor. Especially by the keyfollow thing. In my memory, when I used sync on my Waldorf Pulse, the sound created by a synced osc without key follow was really raw and nasty. I remember that there was quite a difference with and without keyfollow. In reaktor, what we get is not was I remember from analog sync. Actually all digital synth have difficulties creating very good sync sounds I know that (but don't ask me why). But having listened to some stunning instruments made by sme users (like oszilla), I'm pretty sure we can greatly improve this part.
But how?
Help!

edit : i realize i also don't get this -1000 value going into the P input...

 

just to clarify, Dustin Mosley's Ensemble is actually not wired to do Hard or Soft Sync. so unless you modify it, you will not achieve that.

i suggest you have a look at Green Matrix which uses the same Oscillators as the ones Dustin uses, but with the Oscillators connected to achieve Hard and Soft Sync.

see pic, to see how Dustin has not made the connections.

sowari

 

ho I did connect them
I achieved classic hard and soft sync sounds plugin a master oscl into both Snc and SncS inputs.

What I don't get is the way it is built.

I also saw some prety different ways to do sync in other patches (but can't rem where).

 

like syncing one oscillator onto another... that would definately produce some rough sounds, it may be a case of varying the pitches of each oscillator as they are synced to each other, the main oscillator would provide a tonal foundation for all the oscillators that were synced to it, and as the wave of the synced waveforms would jump back to zero at each sync point it would sound quite rough... like the sync becomes abit random but still in tune. in other words it varies in height, timing, by fractions of one frequency (period) and also by multiple periods. so the softsync effect comes from the syncing being modulated by a third set of frequencies that set the sync on and off at adjusteable intervals. you would probably be looking at 7-10 oscillators for a fat sound with some of the detuned by an octave... the reason the sound is fat is always because there are more than 2 frequencies in it, 3-4 is essential and in analogue, the extra frequencies come from the electrical fluctiations.

the digital sync is very regular, you may want to use extra oscs (for fluctuation) going fairly fast to modulate the sync phase of the synced oscs and regularity of the sync point in the master osc by a tuneable amount to make some analogue sounding irregularity... i.e. the master osc would move a lightly above and below the zero crossing according to some detuned oscs, so you could put lots of nuances into the sync effect... the thing is to sync lots of oscs together and to make a maths control structure that modulates all sync variables at different rates to each other, and to fine tune it sothe the frequencies are kindof related and kindof random too. (i.e zero crossing, phase, sync on and off... if you want to sync the master wave at every 2nd 4th 5th peakthen you would add a big wave that makes it go up and down as the sync signal but play the unmodulated master wave as the audible line) and you some filters with high res would be necessary to bring out the parts of the sound that you find the most zingy. a control stucture to modulate 5-6 additional osc frequencies as a semi random detune, from just modding one fader, would sound ok i reckon.

the randomizing frequencies have to be a good mix of related notes and a few cents off.

 

It reverses the phase with each zero crossing of the input signal by just multiplying the frequency with the squared input signal.

To make sure that the input signal has a zero crossing it is mixed (or just added) to the constant value -1.
And to make sure that the input signal gets clipped to -1 and 1, it is gained with a very high amount: 680.
Now the clipped signal jumps from -1 to 1 with every zero crossing anf gets multiplied with the frequency.
That results in inverting (multiplying with -1 at the minimum clipping) the phase, when the input is below 0 and multiplying the frequency with 1 (at the maximum clipping), when the input is higher than 0.


In this structure the oscillator's frequency is controlled only via the linear FM input.
If you dont set a really low value to the logarithmic input you will get a little frequency offset of ca 8 Hz. That's because of the P2F Formula, which gives actually ca 8 Hz for P=0. And this 8 Hz would be than added to the frequency set on the F input.

Sorry for my poor english.

 

OK cool 2 good posts here tx dudes!

repensaw, thx for explaining the patch. I`m not sure to completely get the explanation (why he needs a zero crossing and this jump fro; -1 to 1) but i`ll get more into this patch when i`m back from holidays. Reaktor is kind of a work

synthesizer7 : thanks for putting all these ideas, that`s very interesting! I`ll try to do someof these fine tunings between several oscillators too. But sync is quite a tough topic it seems, it can become a bit complex the way you described i isn`t it?

I always thought sync was just a basic thing, but it`s definitely not!

 

To get the softsync working. As I meant, the slave osc's frequeny is multiplied with this squared (-1;1) input signal.
And when you multiply the frequency with -1, the osc stays exactly in the same tuning but it results in inverting the waveform.
So with every zero-crossing of the squared input the waveform gets turned around.

 

ok thanks for explanation!