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Extremely slow startup of all NI software

Discussion in 'REAKTOR' started by helgoboss, Dec 21, 2013.

  1. EvilDragon

    EvilDragon Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    19,938
    You can always try packing things into a ZIP. Text usually compresses really well.

    Are you using any kind of antivirus software?
     
  2. solar28

    solar28 NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    16
    Thanks for the suggestion EvilDragon. And thanks also to arachnaut for the helpful info. The ProcMon suggestion really highlights whats happening. As to the cause?

    No anti virus software installed. Zipped the file is 7.8 mb but still too large to upload directly. Here is a drop box link for anyone to check out the zip. It unzips to 83 megs. Crazy stuff in there, all going on during the startup of Reaktor 5.exe. https://www.dropbox.com/sh/84pdmpckd776avo/AAB7H1dzltML24vc6asLuVMCa?dl=0
     
  3. solar28

    solar28 NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    16
    Jim/Arachnaut

    Man, I can't thank you enough for the detailed analysis of what you are seeing through Process Monitor. NI would be lucky to have you. I have a ton of stuff to look through from your recommendations. I've gone through and disabled all audio devices except the motherboard audio. I will try this as well. Also made sure that the "Speakers (Realtek High Definition Audio)" device is set for exclusive control.

    I'm going to uninstall all the development software and run crap cleaner + registry decompressor to see if we can speed up the access time. 300ms vs 100ms is a pretty huge difference; it's the difference between 25 secs start up time vs 8 secs. 8 secs I could live with. Perhaps if I can get rid of some of those CLSIDs I can speed it up.

    Also interested in the samsung evo SSD firmware update that Evil Dragon suggested. It's possible the coming firmware update might have a big impact on the performance of a 2 year old registry. I had just ghosted this over to the SSD a couple of months ago, but if the performance of files is based on timestamp (rather than the moment it's actually written to SSD) then that might make a difference.

    Didn't have Kontakt set to scan samples in the database. But nonetheless I removed all the paths from the database, everything. I manually added the libraries from Komplete Ultimate to the library page.

    I will report back after these cleanup efforts, and the Samsung SSD firmware upgrade. I can include scans for startup of both Reaktor 5.exe and Kontakt 5.exe and we will see what shakes down.

    Thanks again to you and Evil Dragon for the tips; I'm learning a lot. (aside: I'm a developer by trade, and this method of running Process Monitor and looking at the chaos has taught me a lot. C#/MVC/Angular. In other words, not registry :) )
     
  4. Pawel Niejadlik

    Pawel Niejadlik New Member

    Messages:
    1
    I've got this problem when using EE USB internet dongle in USB extension hub. System see the dongle as C:\ drive and scans it for licences. Removing dongle from hub solves the problem in my case. Maybe the same solution would work here.
     
  5. madfiddler

    madfiddler NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    35
    Certainly for Massive, the size of your preset/sound database affects the speed of the plugin in general. That includes the load time, the time it takes to move from the Synth to the Attributes to the Browser tab. I presume it's the same for the others. I'm doing a re-install at the moment, and just tested Cubase with Massive to make sure everything is loading correctly... and it took around 10 seconds for Massive to load, and the same time to move between the tabs. I blitzed my user presets directory, and it sped up to acceptable speeds.
     
  6. Super Audio Guy

    Super Audio Guy New Member

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    3
    I noticed a slight increase in load times with version 9, but now in Komplete Ultimate 10, they're ridiculous. 1:20 for first instance! And my machine is no slouch. 6 core 12 thread, 32 GB RAM, SSDs, RAID 5, blah blah blah.

    As interesting as all this info is, it doesn't ultimately seem to contribute to a real solution. And I have better things to do. This thread has been running for 3 years with really only one user claiming NOT to have the issue (2 versions older), and still no input or solutions whatsoever from NI. This doesn't happen with ANY of my other plugs. This is on Native Instruments.

    Those that know me are well aware of my very low tolerance for companies taking peoples money, and then not taking responsibility for the things that don't work. The whole blame game between hardware and software tech supports for example. "It's not us, it's them". We get that the machines you're using for support were built from the ground up just to run YOUR products, but that's just not realistic.

    Seriously. Think about it. What would you say the ratio would be for you between actually making music, and tweaking/fixing things? Who knows for sure, but for me, I would guess 40%:60% respectively, but I also think I'm probably lying to myself.

    I know that these things are involved. Trust me, I know way more about the inner workings of computers than I ever thought I would, or any musician should. I get it. It goes with the territory (witin REASON. tweaking registries and kernels should never be anything the average end user needs to do), but we paid the money you asked for your product with the implied promise that it will work as advertised. I bought your products to make music, not scan thousands of forum threads, send support requests and wait who knows how long for a response that may or may not even be helpful, or (God willing) sit on the phone waiting for a support rep. Just make it work!

    And while I'm on my soapbox, KNOW THE POWER OF YOUR PURCHASE PEOPLE! (This is a general comment not necessarily directed at NI.)
    I can't believe how often I see people just throw away bad products, and go buy another, hoping IT will work. We're only enabling their view that we'll buy anything and not hold them responsible for whether it works or not. I don't know about you, but I work way too hard for my money to just throw it away like that, and I won't let a litle personal discomfort keep me from trying to get it right.
    -RETURN THINGS! Retailers won't carry products that constantly get returned and give them grief.
    -CALL AND COMPLAIN! Some companies don't even give you this option. (Red flag. Shame on them.) But I can't tell you how many times I've gotten great service, free stuff, and in some cases actually seen a new and improved product released based on user feedback.

    Squeeky wheel gets the grease. I know it's not fun. I know it's outside a lot of peoples comfort zone, but it's OUR responsibility.
    Checks and balances on both sides are absolutely essential to the success of anything.

    Thanks for reading.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2016
  7. 6pawny9

    6pawny9 New Member

    Messages:
    2
    I'm wondering if this is a problem only when the computer is USB tethering via a mobile phone. The last time ,before I installed everything on a separate SSD that I got for NI softwares, everything was running smooth, but i was using an Ethernet connection then. This time, it could be an issue due to a USB tethering internet connection OR is it the separate SSD that is causing this to happen?
    P.S.
    Everything loads within half a second the moment i turn my tethering off (disconnect from the internet).

    Windows 10 pro 64-bit
    Core i7 5820k @ 4.5 ghz
    16 GB ddr4 (Quad Channel)
    Samsung 850 Evo 500 x2
    Segate Baracuda 3 TB
    NI Komplete 10 Ultimate
    Live 9 Suite
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2016
  8. 6pawny9

    6pawny9 New Member

    Messages:
    2
    SOLVED: Extremely slow startup of all NI software
    Connecting the PC to Ethernet solved it for me. USB tethering seemed to be the problem for me, could be WiFi issues for others (making a wild presumption here).
    Cheers! :)

    Windows 10 pro 64-bit
    Core i7 5820k @ 4.5 ghz
    16 GB ddr4 (Quad Channel)
    Samsung 850 Evo 500 x2
    Segate Baracuda 3 TB
    NI Komplete 10 Ultimate
    Live 9 Suite
     
  9. Penhorse

    Penhorse NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    20
    On Windows 10, I found that temporarily disabling the Windows Defender "real-time protection" setting causes NI software (and some other software) to start up instantly where otherwise it would take an irritatingly long time. Since doing a fresh install of Windows a few weeks ago I haven't had the problem at all.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. PatriceJ

    PatriceJ New Member

    Messages:
    4
    I confirm your observation and this is a problem for me because I use USB tethering to drive Cubase from my pad using Lemur. If I use it Kontakt takes forever to launch.
    Did NI found a solution for that?
     
  11. PatriceJ

    PatriceJ New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Hello everybody,
    Even if this bug has been pointed out since 2013, NI does not do anything to resolve it.
    I have contacted the support and they are not showing any interest to resolve it quickly.
    I just received an update of Kontakt with improvement that I do not care about (Distortion effects for guitars, who use a digital distortion for guitar? :=) ) they should concentrate on making their product perfect.
    It is frankly annoying, not at the level of the brand.
     
  12. sleen

    sleen NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    890
    In my case, the resolution was to disable USAGE DATA TRACKING. Reaktor was taking a very long time to load as were others. In Native Access there is an option in the settings to globally disable USAGE DATA TRACKING. For me, this did not work and I had to open each application and disable in the settings. I doubt there is a single reason for slow opening, but if anyone is checking antivirus etc, you might want to disable NI spyware. ;)
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  13. PatriceJ

    PatriceJ New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Hello Sleen,
    Thank you very much for your advise.
    Unfortunately it is something that I have tried and it does not work fro for me with Kontakt (I do not use Reaktor).
    Maybe you are right this has to do with "spyware" from NI or maybe anti piracy protection, which, if it is the case, annoy musician that bought their software!
    Enjoy music....
    Patrice
     
  14. PatriceJ

    PatriceJ New Member

    Messages:
    4
    I'm frustrated with this problem that has not been resolved in earlier version. NI do not give any time to resolve it, this is not pro.