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New Kontrol S4Mk3 LOAD/CPU Issues using 96kHz Quality

Discussion in 'Bug Reports' started by lem_sessions, Sep 29, 2021.

  1. lem_sessions

    lem_sessions NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    40
    PC - AMD 6-Core 3.4Ghz 32GB of RAM - 96kHz, 1024 , 4ms Buffer
    Surface - Intel Core i5 1.8Ghz 8GB of RAM - 96kHz, 2048, 4ms Buffer

    Let's start with saying that for me the Kontrol S4MK3 was one of the best Music purchases I have made, except maybe the Original Traktor Final Scratch. It supports 4 different audio quality levels, and the highest of them all is 96kHz. Also, I have figured out that the workaround for this issue is to use 44.1kHz, as that lets me do a LOT more without the Load hitting the dreaded red-zone, when it starts skipping. However, I have a lot of 24bit/96kHz FLAC files, that are simply wasted when you record in 44.1kHz quality. Based on CPU usage, both machines should be able to support 4 tracks simultaneously and many FX on top of that, and they do, except at 96kHz. I have a Studio PC and a Microsoft Surface 6 Tablet (with HDMI/LAN hub) and am looking to be recording at maximum quality on both machines. The reason I started using the Surface for DJing, is that my main collection on the PC will only work with Traktor 3.4, large collections do not work with 3.5+. So I setup the Surface for DJing and did not really experience any Load Issues until recently when I started Recording. I have installed 3.5.2 on both machines for proper comparison. You should also know I completely reinstalled Windows 10 from Scratch on the Surface and have only installed Traktor on it, however all for nothing as the Load and CPU usage are pretty much the same as before the reset.

    While spikes in LOAD do not necessarily give higher CPU usage, I still want to provide test data for it. The main reason here being that Traktor can use as much as 20% CPU JUST SITTING THERE 'IDLE', but that goes down when you disconnect the S4MK3. This happens on both machines.

    SURFACE (96) - Idle CPU 15%, Playing 2 Tracks - 25%, NO MIXER 5.5% (still doing something)
    PC (96) - Idle CPU 17%, Playing 2 Tracks 20%, Playing 4 Tracks 30%, NO MIXER 4%
    The Load is much harder to turn red when we change the Quality to CD 44.1kHz. Also changing BUFFER SIZE on the S4MK3 from 2ms to 4ms had a positive impact - less audio outs.

    I have never seen a CPU usage spike and I have never seen it move past 40%, it's always the LOAD that spikes and slows the audio down at what seem like sometimes random times. There are a lot less of these spikes when using the 96 option on the PC, which is much faster and has way more memory. The nice thing is that Traktor is a Trooper, even when it skips/slows down the real time playback, the recording still works, however I need to be able to avoid these in order to record high quality files properly.

    Yes I have tried DPCLAT.exe for latency measuring and both computers are surprisingly steady, and both are pretty even - about 1,200. So where do these high LOADs and spikes come from? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

    Some questions:

    (1) Why is the Traktor CPU usage so high that it reaches 20% when the software is supposed to be doing nothing. It is DEFINITELY related to the S4MK3 mixer and/or driver, as when unplugged the cpu usage go down substantially, but while CPU usage is much lower, the LOAD for some reason keeps hovering at 50% - could this be the problem?

    (2) Could this useless CPU usage be causing problems while playing tracks back and employing FX ie causing unnecessarily high load?

    (3) How come the load keeps fluctuating back and forth when Traktor is just sitting there with the mixer hooked up? No wonder it skips if I even play one song sometimes.

    (4) Is there any chance of me recording 96khz on the Surface Pro without skips? What is the deal with the high CPU usage when Traktor is sitting there idle? What sort of things can I measure/tweak to help this happen?

    MOST IMPORTANT - on the Surface - LOAD remains high (50%+) as well when mixer is unplugged (to plug it into the PC) while the CPU usage goes down to almost 0%. This load is HIGHER than the PC WITH the mixer plugged in (about 25%).
    UPDATE: if Surface Load is low when the mixer is hooked up but not playing, then chances are much better of it working without audio outs, however this still needs more testing while it's recording, not just playing.

    PS - anyone here get S4mk3 working and recording at 96kHz? If so, what kind of PC do you have (not interested in Macs)? How is the load when you record?

    PPS - This is all done on Normal Priority for task Traktor.exe, I find switching it any higher results in more Load. Also tried this on NIHardwareService.exe but did not seem to help. Also playing 2496 on the Surface seems rather farfetched, I cannot even get one FLAC to play on the Surface. The lower quality FLACs seem to work okay.

     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2021
    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. lem_sessions

    lem_sessions NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    40
    Have settled for 48kHz (DVD quality) setting which lets me go 512 bytes and 4ms USB Buffer with 4 320kbs MP3s playing no problem, it even lets me play 24/96 FLAC files with significant less load. 24/192 FLAC files I do not need Traktor to support, but boy they sound amazing in playback.
    Still would like anyone's thoughts on this whole situation with Quality and Load on 96 setting. I will be trying this again on my Studio PC, as it is much more powerful but for now - the mixing is working - it's time to do some recording.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  3. lem_sessions

    lem_sessions NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    40
    So the final setup is that I will be running the AMD 6 core PC with latest Traktor 3.5.2 at 96kHz, it seems to be able to handle much more that the Surface Pro, which now has the latest Ableton Live 11 on it and will be my Live machine. If need be Traktor can be run on the Surface and record at 48kHz, however doubtful I will be playing out anytime soon. I will still have to figure out where to fit Resolume 6 VJing in this setup.

    If you're having LOAD issues, try your collection on a faster PC to see if it works any better - it did for me.
     
  4. Wyley

    Wyley NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,445
    As far as I can remember amd chips always had issues with DJ software. Maybe because it’s not in the required specs for Traktor use or any other of the major DJ software.

    Serato tried once upon a time to work with Microsoft to have serato work on the surface line. They went as far as making a joint statement and then had to retract it because they couldn’t get it working.

    If it’s working out for you then cool.