Legato strings (Kontakt 3) How to play

I have a question. I am new to digital orchestration. I have made some pretty cool sounding songs, but still cannot, or don't know how to, obtain that unbroken flow in playing strings.

If you have a string section where all the strings play together without any other instrument, how do you get it to go from one note to the other without that distinct keyboard switch.

I dont know music terms, but how to get legato. If I play I have to so carefully use my sustain pedal when going from one chord to the other (with strings), but still get that break in the flow.

Don't laugh but this is what I mean.

If you where to hum what I mean it would be like:

hhhhhhh -hhhhhh -hhhhhh -hhhhh -hhhh
A continuous flow in the strings playing

Now when I am playing the strings and going from one chord to the other it is more like

ta, ta, ta, ta, ta

There is definite break in the flow of the chords.

Is this continuous flow obtained by programming Kontakt 3, or by choosing a specific playing style with my strings. I am using Sustain and legato.

I hope this makes sense. I don't know how else to explain what I am looking for.

THANK YOU all you MUSIC GURUS out there !
And excuse my lack of Theory terms !

 

You can add a legato script to you sustain patch to have a smoother transition. Go into the script editor/preset/factory/performance ans click on Unison-Portamanto.

Now you can edit the parameter of your script to your liking. Play with the portamento control and X-fade etc.. until you find what you're looking for.

The VSL legato instrument should give you a good transition sound as they are real legato. Maybe you could increase the release in the ADSR if it's a very slow piece.. It might make the transition smoother. Give it a try! To do this, go in edit mode and go at the very bottom of you instrument and look for release in the right, and turn it up.

Also, i strongly suggest you play with the volume(CC7) after you've recorded the part(that's done in the sequencer of your midi editor). What i mean by this is you need to spend time drawing little curves(fade in) right after the start of the notes and fade out at the end of the notes etc.. This can give a lot of life to your part and is an important part of the process if you want to play musical phrases that are ... well musical! To make it sing if you will. It take time but it's essential IMO.

Of course it's hard to know what you're looking from here that should help.

Good luck!

 

Thank you SO much. This is exactly what I was looking for. THANK YOU !

 

HOWEVER... I just noticed that with Legato in Violin, Viola, Cello I can only play one key. I can not do multiple chords. It is like in real life. But how for instance if I wanted harmonies would I get that with legato without dong a layering of 15 strings to get that harmony ?

 

Is there a Video Tutorial for someone like me that has never done orchestration before to now all these things. I would have never ever known that there are these scripts. Where can I learn more about how to load and tweak instruments to get the best when you do digital orchestration. Things like scripts etc. etc. ?

 

The ideal solution would be to have more than one string library for that, and smaller section if you can. However i assume you only have the library that came with K3.. So in that case you will have to load the same legato instrument a second time in an other track. That way you can pan it in a different spot in the stereo field. I assume you know what panning is?

Also, it's important to narrow the stereo field a little when you work with VSL, that's due to how they record their instrument... I cant tell you how to do that since i don't know what software you are using...

I hope i understood your question correctly...

 

There are tutorials included with K3. On your hard drive, go to program file/Native instruments/Kontakt 3/Tutorials. ..and you'll find a few there. I didn't watch them myself so...

Also, it's always a good idea to reed the manual.

Also, try to go study instrument you have. Go in edit mode and see how they were builded.

Here are a couple of K2 tutorials i found. K2 is very similar to K3..

http://www.matsc.net/Kurs/Kontakt 2 Eng/Introduction.htm

http://kevintweedy.net/TUTORIALS.htm

I hope that was helpful.

 

NI also makes a DVD tutorial for Kontakt2 that is still very useful. Check out the NI store.

Agree with you that a set of tutorials on digital orchestration would be helpful, but I think the problem is that there are really 2 things that would need to be taught: music theory/composition/arranging and the mechanics of midi orchestration. That's a tall order and would likely satisfy no one (too shallow for the musos and too deep for the newbies).

 

Thank you Geronimo and Gnapier

You all have been so helpfull. Gosh. Thank you for taking time to just write back. Thank you !

Good to now about the panning and that I should not do it to wide. See it stuff like that that I want to know and would have never if you did not tell me.

I use other libraries as well apart from just the stuff that came with K3.

 

I second what gnapier said about the DVD tutorial for Kontakt2. It did help me, although you should find that info in the manual..

Also, you should try to fin music forums and do research and ask questions in those forums if your research weren't fruitful. Try to visit the VSL forum maybe? And NSS which has been running for a while now. You will find the Garritan forum there which
seems to be a vibrant place to learn and i think there are tutorials there too. As i said, do try to research in these forums and you wont be sorry. Here is the link to NSS:

http://www.northernsounds.com/forum/index.php?

P.S. I just wanted to add that's it's not a good idea to play string cords like you would play on the piano. Unless you want to play pads(like a synth), you should think see as each notes are a different sections.. just like in real life.

Best of luck!

 

Wow. Great thread. I have had exactly the same question about legato as Ben2u. Nice insights here. Any more pearls of wisdom about legato playing? What does unison-portamento script/control actually do to the samples? (I've not tackled the script language yet)

 

Well I've not tackled the script language either. The best thing to do to find out what they do is to try them i guess. Maybe there is some info in the manual about these script too. But in this case, the unison-portamento is a what's called a legato script which emulates connective note like slides and portamentos. It seems to work pretty well but I've used a couple of times so..

this link will probably be of interest to you:

http://nilsliberg.se/ksp/scripts/scripts.html

I hope Nils doesn't mind me posting it..

 

ben2u, I can't comment on the unison-portamento script, but I can share my experiences with Legato instruments (I'm still on K2).

The key to getting legato to work is in distinguishing between a starting note and the other notes in a legato. Obviously, the starting note has a distinct attack whereas the other notes will have a continuous transition between them. In MIDI terms, if a note overlaps or begins exactly where another left off, KONTAKT will play it as legato. If a note begins with any time gap from the end of the previous note, it is considered a starting note.

This is particularly important with wind instruments, like the Legato Flute. When using this instrument, I deliberately ensure that gaps occur in the MIDI notes at regular intervals - otherwise it would sound like the player had an infinite supply of breath. It's amazing how those gaps suddenly make the flute part sound real and not synthesized. In the case of the 4-piece Legato French Horn ensemble, I relax this practice a bit because it is unlikely that you'd hear all players taking a breath at once!

As far as harmonies go, the only way of doing this is to have multiple instances of an instrument in your rack and have them each driven from separate MIDI files, each playing a different part of the harmony. In other words, exactly like in real life, you would have separate players or sections doing each part. In the case of strings (e.g. 14 violins in each section), this will lead to a really BIG string sound, the more parts you add. I often do harmonies with violins and violas - I'm trying to stay away from having 42 violins (3 x 14)!

Now of course, this is all about using these instruments with MIDI files. Playing live is another matter entirely, which I have not mastered and couldn't imagine trying to describe here.

 

VSL uses this tool to do the technique mentioned above...

 

Hey!

I just came across something that I think you find to be extremely helpful (if you have not seen this already). Go to the VSL site > Video tutorials. (http://vsl.co.at/en/211/442/371/456.vsl) There is a set of tutorials there on using VSL Special Edition. The tutorials focus on using the product (of course) to create a particular orchestral piece, but there is ALOT of info there on arranging the piece, using effects, using volume and other controls for switching between voicings, proper use of reverb, etc.

The same principles can be applied to Kontakt in most cases...and I think its orchestral samples are based on a real cut down version of VSL anyway.

Slightly OT: The VSL special edition for $445 looks damn interseting. There is also a product called Synful Orchestra that uses some combination of sampling/synthesis/and database technology to deliver some amazingly realistic results (www.synful.com).

Anyway, I wish someone would take the VSL tutorials and blow them out into a full blown exploration of midi orchestration.

Hope this helps.

GN

 

For another great K2 resource and plenty of discussion about Legato scripts as well as SIPS (the definitive public legato script) go here:

http://vi-control.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=65

Cheers,

T

 

another trick to get midi strings to sound more legato: once you have played the part into your sequencer, change the length of notes by adding a few ticks to all notes in the passage. then go through and reduce velocity of any notes whose attack may be too strong.
-Bruce