Maschine Mk3 - Controlling Ableton Live 10

Discussion in 'MASCHINE Area' started by Keith Mann, Jul 7, 2019.

  1. Keith Mann

    Keith Mann New Member

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    6
    Hey

    I'm searching for something that must exist.

    I want to use the Mk3 to control Ableton Live 10 mainly and also use the machine software to host instruments (occasionally) but just for the pad features for chords/playing melodies. Switching using shift+midi mode seems a perfect solution for this.

    I have downloaded the controller template that was released by NI but it seems really limited. Most buttons are not mapped. I also checked out the Logic Pro X templates (some user ones downloaded) and they are perfect.

    I can't seem to find any 'custom' templates anywhere.

    Also, I thought about making my own but get stuck as the most used Ableton shortcuts are 'key commands' and not midi cc's.

    Is what I want possible? Does anyone have any tips or workarounds or can offer any help at all.

    Fingers crossed.


    Keefy :)
     
  2. DataStrainMusic

    DataStrainMusic NI Product Owner

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    The MK3 Legacy template is the closest to the other Maschine templates but is indeed incomplete and will not be finished. This was confirmed to me via email and I made a thread about it some months ago.

    Host Integration is the new move for Maschine, but is again still limited and incomplete. It's a cool start but really doesn't do much as is.

    I've seen some make custom templates in the past but I don't think you can reach the same level of complexity that NI achieved with the previous scripts.

    At the end of the day I ended up going back to my Push 1 for controlling Live.
     
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  3. Keith Mann

    Keith Mann New Member

    Messages:
    6
    Thanks for the reply.

    I'm a bit gutted about this tbf. The MK3 was bought to replace the Mikro MK3 as that didn't have controller editor support. I needed something that would work with both Ableton & LPX. It really is a cracking bit of kit but just doesn't play well with others. I wish I had read your thread before buying it and just gone for the Push.

    Seems bizarre that what I want is totally possible and surely relatively easy? (using the duplicate button to cmd+D selected objects for instance).

    I have managed to map some of the unused buttons to some of the functions but struggle to find a way to attach them to 'keybaord' shortcuts.

    Shame..... again thanks for the reply! :)
     
  4. Seta

    Seta NI Product Owner

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    I also own the Mk3 and I have started using ableton just to find out the newest MK3 is the least supported in ableton...I bought maschine jam Arsenal template from Native Kontrol. I would happily buy a proper maschine mk3 ableton template for 50€...I will never spend another € on expansion or Sounds.com; I just upgraded to Komplete 12 mainly to add value to what I already own and I may probably end up selling.
    This is NI...half baked products for the wannabe; standalone maschine software missing basic features (song layer, proper automation, delay compensation (both for ext.hardware and plug ins), a legacy Ableton template that will never be finished and new integration template/mode that was abandoned before completion who knows why....They will have to expend money on advertising; I advice people to run away from NI and start either with Ableton or FL and I guess many people is doing the same...
    We can always get some money back by selling, but all the time spent on the platform is something we will never get back...Kore users learnt this the hard way
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2019
  5. Keith Mann

    Keith Mann New Member

    Messages:
    6
    HI Seta

    Firstly, I should have known, as a former Kore 2 user (literally threw this out recently).

    I bought the Maschine Mikro Mk3 only to realise that it didn't play well with Ableton or Logic as there was no controller editor support. A support request was met with the infamous 'I will pass this on to the developers'. But after researching A LOT, there was a template for the Maschine Mk3. So I purchased that.

    I was quite confident that it would do what I wanted it to do..... but nope! I was quite wrong.

    I'm left scratching my head. The hardware is a wonderful piece of kit. But the Ableton template is a joke. And to add further insult, now comes with the word Legacy just to rub it in. Legacy for a product they still sell.

    It's just a shame...... it's surely quite easy for them to finish the controller editor support as they have done before with the previous Maschine products?

    Maybe the Mk4 is just around the corner, which will come with DAW integration **coming soon**

    Rant over!!!!!
     
  6. DataStrainMusic

    DataStrainMusic NI Product Owner

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    153
    So after a little digging I found the uncompiled python script for the MK3 on GitHub:
    https://github.com/gluon/AbletonLive10_MIDIRemoteScripts/tree/master/Maschine_Mk3_Legacy

    From what I can tell (forgive me as I know very little about this subject) the scripts ARE written out completely. All the features that should be active are written into the code. It seems like this template may be incomplete only from the Controller Editor side of things. This is far above my head personally but I'm sure anyone with Python and C.E experience would be able to finish it up.

    Personally I would be willing to pay for someone to do this for a reasonable fee, as I'm sure others would as well.
     
  7. Stormchild

    Stormchild NI Product Owner

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    474
    There are some nice templates for Maschine Jam that makes it work really well with Ableton Live. Having the same number of pads (as Push) makes it a lot more straightforward to map it to Live. Here’s a video showing how it works with the default template that comes with Maschine Jam.

    I don’t think Maschine mk3 is a great fit for Live. Doesn’t seem worth the effort to do extensive programming trying to make it work. It might be a fun project if you’re into that kind of thing though. Personally I’d recommend either getting a Maschine Jam (if you don’t want to spend a lot) or Push 2 (if you’re really serious about having a great controller for Live, nothing else you can hack together will come close).
     
  8. DataStrainMusic

    DataStrainMusic NI Product Owner

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    153
    I think the MK3 would a make great controller for Live,and I'm already a push user (Push 1). Nice hi res screens that can handle a lot of info, great pads that play very well, tons of accessory buttons that can be mapped to access most parameters in live. The built in audio interface and brightness with USB power already beats Push 2 in portability. I mean functionality wise the Maschine Studio was a beefy controller for Live, worked very well. The MK3 would be even better with that 4D Encoder getting used.
     
  9. Uwe303

    Uwe303 NI Product Owner

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    6,492
    I really don´t understand why every big ableton update screwe up the templates, that´s definetly a ableton issue.

    Uwe
     
  10. DataStrainMusic

    DataStrainMusic NI Product Owner

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    153
    I definitely get that, especially with the Jam, but in this case NI just abandoned the MK3 template. At least that's what their customer support told me. Guess I'm gonna have to learn me some python and controller editor cause otherwise nothing's getting done about it.
     
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  11. Seta

    Seta NI Product Owner

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    29
    At the end I decided to sell my maschine mk3 (and komplete 12 upg with it) because of the bad ableton integration and lack of proper ableton templates. Besides having to use a pseudo DAW inside a DAW seems like a mental workflow to me.

    However I am keeping Maschine Jam (and Komplete select 11 with it) while I wait for a good Push 2 deal , because of the properish NI ableton template but especially because of Arcade series returns and Arsenal Native Kontrol (this one I already own). Once I have a push 2 I will keep the JAM too. I am also keeping my M32, now that NI has announced future control editor support (I was selling it to).

    Maybe one day I will return to Maschine software but I can not stay hopping one day it will become a game changer.
     
  12. Uwe303

    Uwe303 NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    6,492
    Thats exactly why i always recommend to use it stand alone, even if i sometimes try something as plugin in cubase but never was a good experience to me. Do as much as possible stand alone then export audio and mix in your daw and maybe add a little here and there.

    Uwe
     
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  13. DataStrainMusic

    DataStrainMusic NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    153
    I totally understand that. If my cat didn't scratch up my MK3 I would've sold it by now (not terrible just a few minor scratches but enough to feel bad about selling.) Maschine standalone simply doesn't have everything I need all at once like Ableton does. I used to excuse NI's actions in the past but I just can't do it anymore.

    Crazy to think my Digitakt works better with Ableton than Maschine and is also standalone.
     
  14. Seta

    Seta NI Product Owner

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    29
    Having to use maschine as a standalone and then export audio or use it directly as a VST, both are a PITA and is something I do not want to do. I can do everything directly in ableton, so I will just have to focus in one piece of software.
    I know that ableton is going to keep being developed and it is supported by a lot of hardware and software developers, whereas no one knows what the future is for Maschine software. As I said before, if one day I feel maschine is superior (or simply fill my needs compared) to ableton I will come back to it, but I seriously doubt it
    As long as it works OK you can always sell, of course you should sell cheaper. My JAM has few scratches I couldn't care less about.
    I can not describe how much fun I am having just using ableton as a multitrack recorder for my external hardware; of course it comes with its own flaws but I just started and the only thing I miss is more hands on control, that will come when I get Ableton Push
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2019
  15. Leinadbrotes

    Leinadbrotes New Member

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    2
    Last week I was able to use the MK3 for controlling Ableton Live 10 (session and arrangement), if you want some setting details i can post screenshots here! Cheers :)
     
  16. Keith Mann

    Keith Mann New Member

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    That would be good! :)
     
  17. Et_Voila

    Et_Voila NI Product Owner

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    68
    Hi,

    I wonder for what purpose .(Clip launch, and use the strip as faders control ? )
     
  18. Seta

    Seta NI Product Owner

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    29
    Faders for mixing, but especially third party templates like Arsenal Native Kontrol or Isotonik Arcade series returns
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  19. Et_Voila

    Et_Voila NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    68
    Thanks. I'll have to test again the template, or a template for Jam. The only day I tried it was a disaster...
     
  20. Uwe303

    Uwe303 NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    6,492
    I also really don't know why native is not opening the driver for other developers so they can make proper integration with full support of the screens for all the daws and sell it or whatever. That would add a lot of value if you then could also switch back and forth between the two modes with shift + midi. But I guess native then only sees people using maschine forever with other daws without selling new ones instead seeing the people buying it cause of that absolutely amazing function.

    Uwe
     
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