Also let's be clear here - with something like Adobe software, you can upgrade and it will still open your old files. So you have a solution there (and the company can offer free or cheap upgrades as compensation). With audio plugins like Pro53, which have no upgrade path that allows you to preserve their sounds as-was, NI has just permanently broken old and existing DAW projects. All music that used them can never be reworked or re-rendered. This is not acceptable. To be clear: NI does not have to support old software. It does not have to patch it, or make sure it runs on newer OS'. But it _cannot_ deliberately stop them working altogether (even on old supported setups). This is especially important with audio, as it breaks all legacy audio projects in a way that can not be rectified. That's why we buy perpetual licenses. If the company goes bust, then all bets are off (you can still try to sue them but it may not work). But NI is a trading, thriving company. They cannot legally do this, nor should they want to screw their customers this way.
Who is putting you up to this? You are totally missing the point! As a Komplete user I already had Super 8 (I don't even care about that although I was still grateful to get R2 or something like that which I never used to date!) but I did use Pro53 with jBridge before N.I. rendered that un-activatable. This is a point of principle - the principle that we have a company tell us how to use the software we buy on any system. If I want to make music using a ZX81 that should be my prerogative! It is not acceptable to just to totally kill something and provide no ability to continue to use it just because it suits the company! Let's hear the black and white explanation then Matt @ NI. Why can't you produce a final update that fixes this situation? What is stopping you? The person who made the terrible "business decision" to pull the activation server clearly didn't think things through! They must have known it wouldn't go down well with some users - the ones that helped the company get to where it is now. What thanks do we get? I've been in this game long enough to remember when Propellerhead software (as it was known at the time) halted development on ReBirth RB-338 - at least users could continue to use it on older systems if they chose to. This does not give you the option and is simply UNACCEPTABLE! What is Native Instruments going to do to resolve this and future inevitable situations? You have highlighted a big flaw in your business model. What's to stop you ditching Native Access tomorrow? Who knows with this company now? Just throw us a bone and hope we'll shut up eh?
Native Access.... It raises another question. How will I activate plugins on older OS (which I might need to run because of other plugins/SW) if NI decides NA will not run on those? Even when it would be possible to activate my NI plugins, it might not be possible on older OS, where I need it activate..... So, NI. Please support all, even legacy, OS in Native Access. For Win say starting Win NT, if not Win 2000. Definitely Win 7 forever.
I am not suggesting N.I. should be obliged to support the software plugin fiercer but to not even be able to use the thing even on an older system is outrageous. After all if it meets the system requirements....
Well, I do not speak about plugins. In NI decides not to support them on newer OS OK. That is legitimite. I speak about posibility to run and activate plugins on systems they were developer for. Say, plugin was designed for Win XY and supported up to Win XYZ. And say, the plugin must be activated using Native Access. So, Native Access must run on Win XY up to Win XYZ. I made many projects under Win 7, so I require that I will have possibility to activate/use those plugins in Win 7 even in year 2050 or later.....
Any updates on changes of policy on this Native Instruments? If not, there needs to be. What are you going to do differently?
We'll keep advocating to see if anything can be done here. I've shared your feedback with our team and I'll get back to this thread if there is any changes.
Thank you Matt NI Marcus "Keep Pushin'" to the top as Boris Dlugosch once produced! That is one filthy bassline! (13) Keep Pushin' (Remastered) - YouTube
This. Let me explain one more time (sorry to those that got it): my first single uses Pro53 prominently. I can no longer re-work or even just re-render it from my DAW. And I can no longer perform it live with the original sounds. See how serious this is?? _Famous_ artists (which I'm not) will have used Pro53 in hit singles. For arguments sake, let's say an old Lady Gaga single used it (it might have, she's synth heavy). You're now telling all those artists, they can never remix, re-render or perform their singles with the original sounds again. Get it now?? I don't want a Repro license (that was the only viable workaround, and would involve significant work on my part porting sounds and DAW automation - and will never sound exactly the same). I want to be able to continue using the software I paid a perpetual license for. Companies cannot kill perpetual licenses. It's not about entitlement - what NI did is an assault on the legacy of recorded music. It cannot be allowed, and it's not legal. (and no, I'm not a hater, I use NI software that I love, bar bugs, everywhere, and I've always admired their liberal license transfer policies).
Totally agree ReBased. I am stunned by the attitude of this company. For years (before this decision was taken) I remember contacting N.I. and asking them when they were going to update the plug-in to 64 but and all I got was PR guff from people not ruling it out. To just pull the plug was a sad day in the life of this company, but I know they will come good eventually. There are after all plenty of alternatives around so why run the risk of it happening again at some point in the future?
I agree with ReBased. Time unlimited licence may not be terminated. NI should find a way to solve the situation for all their SW and all users. They may continue do it offline. Yes it is costly. Or NI may release plugin not needing autenthisation or using a new autenthisation scheme. Or they could even refresh the plugin and release it in reborn.... Or NI may issue universal key, if possible. There are many possibilities to resolve the situation.... On contrary, NI has no obligation to make the plugin 64 bit. Or solve possible problems in certain DAWs or OS. After they terminated the development. It might be nice, but that is all.
I've been going round in circles with them for ages now, trying to get my Pro-53 reactivated. If I launch the Pro-53 on my Mac I have the options: Activate / Buy / Demo. At the top of the window with these options in it, it says: "Your hardware has changed. Please use the Service Center to re-activate". When I try to do this it fails as the Service Center is now defunct. If I launch Native Access the Pro-53 is showing with its serial number and "Full Version", even though I can only get it to run in Demo mode. I have explained this to them repeatedly and each time I get an email saying "Your request (#xxxxxxx) has been deemed solved." Each time I have to go back to them and say it isn't solved. How hard is it for them to simply unlock it from Demo mode for registered users?
This is what they promised they would do in this situation in their own EULA for Service Center: (on Windows find this at C:\Program Files\Native Instruments\Service Center\Documentation\License Agreement\EULA Native Instruments English.rtf) Section II -> 2. (my emphasis) : It is not possible to use Native Instruments products that are not activated. <snip> Should Native Instruments, for whatever reasons, no longer be able to fulfill its obligations to deliver the activation key, it will provide Licensee with a key which ensures the continued use of the Licensed Software independent of changes to the computer. This is what they legally promised, this is obviously what they should do. Without it, there is only legal action, or risk using cracked software. I have zero interest in that - I only use valid licenses, and even for a special-case like this, where the laws in some countries allow modifying validly licensed software when there is no other way to run it or correct errors, the risk of malware is high. NI shouldn't put us in this position. Their strategy (as seen on their document detailing the discontinuation of Service Centre, and mirrored in their responses here and on support request threads) is to give vague assurances of possible future solutions, which are clearly just meant to diffuse passion so they can avoid doing anything unless absolutely necessary. Not acceptable. Matt @ NI, do you have a solid update?
I wonder what legal action would cost and if enough of us would want to share that cost to make it viable?
That is worth looking at if it becomes necessary. Because it's not just about Pro53; NI needs to understand the principles at stake, else they will do this again. And they don't get to break their contracts with us (just as they won't accept us doing it). Let's hope they get it and do the right thing.
In case of winning the case, NI would have to pay the cost.... Generally it would be good to share the cost among more users. Maybe using some kind of Consumer Protection Organisation would help. I hope NI will solve it. I do not have Pro53, but I have K13U CE, so almost all NI current stuff. I do not want face the same situation like you in 10, 20, 30, 40 years...
The annoying thing for me is that the Pro-53 works in demo mode, so I can't believe it would be that hard to make it work properly. I was half way through a big project when I changed computer and, foolishly, wiped the old one. The sounds that I used from the Pro-53 are so unique I can't possibly replicate them with another synth and they've played such a significant role in dictating the character of the project that it's not an option to re-work it with new sounds. I suppose if the worse comes to the worse I can use it in demo mode and accept that I'll have to re-start the plug-in every half an hour.
I know this is going to be disappointing to hear but I do not have an update and honestly won't have much to share in the coming weeks. This is not something we're planning to bring on the table again right now, especially considering we've already had weeks of conversation on this topic with a lot of users almost almost a year ago. I would also love for Pro-53 to be able to activate again and I'll make sure to bring it up as much as I can.