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Racks - do I have this straight?

Discussion in 'REAKTOR' started by killmaster, Jun 27, 2021.

  1. killmaster

    killmaster NI Product Owner

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    787
    I'm attempting to familiarize myself with how Racks work. Haven't used them in my music before but going to be spending a lot of time with them soon. So, in order to save a patch or preset, I have to save the whole Rack, is that correct? There is no such thing as snapshot or presets in the same way in Racks, right? So a snapshot in Racks is a whole unique Rack saved to disc?
     
  2. Paule

    Paule NI Product Owner

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    7,555
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2021
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  3. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

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    3,969
    Yes. However, racks are tiny.
    Try saving a rack, then converting it to an ensemble and saving that, then compare the file sizes!
    The ensemble stores all the structure, all the instruments, modules, macros etc. The rack just stores references to blocks, and the connecting wires.
     
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  4. nanotable

    nanotable NI Product Owner

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    44
    How is it possible to create and save snapshots within a Rack, and what would be the benefit?

    My understanding is that to save a patch/preset, you save the Rack, which creates a corresponding file on your drive. That’s it.
     
  5. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

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    3,969
    Not sure. It's probably possible using a custom interface on a bespoke Block, and it could be useful in the case of e.g. an FM block where there are 1000's of possible sounds and programming is difficult. In that case it would be nice to be able to store and recall instrument level snapshots.
    Need to do some research...
    Presets are also saved as an individual file on your drive. Snapshots are part of the Ensemble or Insturment.

    When you save a Rack, you are saving all the inter-Block connection information. Snapshots and Presets cannot save that information - they only save control settings like knob values etc. So if you patch up your blocks differently, old presets/snapshots don't make sense because the structure has changed.
     
  6. Moujik

    Moujik NI Product Owner

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    1,761
    I'm fairly sure some Toybox Audio blocks use snapshots in a rack context (although am in the middle of moving house so don't have access to my PC to check).
     
  7. killmaster

    killmaster NI Product Owner

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    787
    I believe the snapshots in Toybox are per block, so an individual block on the rack can store its own set of 8 presets, or maybe that's now what you are referring to. But it's cool cause you have access to morph the presets.
     
  8. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

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    3,969
    Just did a check with a 'User' block in a Rack, and the Instrument level presets are available and usable.
    The issue is that snapshots are stored as part of the instrument, and the instrument is not saved when you save a Rack, only a reference is saved. So Instrument level snapshots in a Rack context work, but are read only. You can't save some new settings as a snapshot directly from a Rack.
     
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  9. killmaster

    killmaster NI Product Owner

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    787
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  10. Paule

    Paule NI Product Owner

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    7,555
    Brett wrote here in the forum: preper snapshots in the ens area to use them in Racks.
    You can't create snaps in Racks.
    Only using the existing snaps is possible.
     
  11. killmaster

    killmaster NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    787
    so good to know. Thanks. Easier when you imagine you are using a hardware rack. They don't load or save as fast but not a big deal. In a way it's kinda better to think of it this way. I have ensembles with thousand of snapshots, but I'll be more discerning when I save a rack!
     
  12. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

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    3,969

    You can actually create snapshots in Racks!, you just can't save them, so it's a pointless exercise :p
     
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  13. killmaster

    killmaster NI Product Owner

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    787
    Also very good to know. Thanks!
     
  14. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

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    3,969
    In a Blocks context, snapshots don't make so much sense anyway. Most of the 'patch' is in the way different blocks are connected together, and snapshots don't currently store that info. The only place they would be useful is in those blocks like FM, complex oscillators, maybe compressors, reverbs, or other harder to program FX... etc. In that case a stack of read only snapshots makes sense so there are starting points for different types of sounds.
    A developer might be able to create a bespoke patch system using shared event tables that would allow storing and recalling from Racks... not sure if that would work, but it might be possible?
     
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  15. nanotable

    nanotable NI Product Owner

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    44
    Thanks for the explanation and clarification, colB and Paule. And yeah, Toybox‘s per Block snapshot morphing is brilliant, shame that it’s a third party thing.
     
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  16. killmaster

    killmaster NI Product Owner

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    787
    Really appreciate the thorough explanation! Really helpful.
     
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  17. Moujik

    Moujik NI Product Owner

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    1,761
    Seems like we've gotten to the bottom of this, but as colB suggests, the utility here for me is e.g reverb settings where you can quickly select between big hall, drum room etc.
     
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