Rickenbacker bass needs negative delay offset... how in Maschine?

As documented by Scarbee himself, The Rickenbacker bass (for Kontakt) requires that the track it's on be delayed by -33ms, +/- a bit depending on the settings of the patch in use.

When I use this in Ableton Live, I can simply make the track delays visible and enter in "-33" and everything works fine. Without this, the timing of the instrument is always off.

Now I want to use it in Maschine... and suddenly find I have no idea how to create a negative delay offset for any tracks. I've looked for free plugins, but they always add positive delay values, not offering negative.

As it stands, I'm not sure how to use this instrument successfully in Maschine, short of turning off all the scraping effects that give the instrument all of its realism.

Any help is much appreciated!
-Michael

 

a negative delay of 33mS?.. That's a cool way of saying "my VST has garbage latency"...

You can of course, instead of giving one track an advance, simply delay all other tracks by the 33mS, which will result in the same thing.

 

Very interesting. I also developed a track in Maschine with Rickenbacker and found that it sounds better live than when exported to wav format. May be because of different latency delay. But really in live play mode I don't notice any delay. 33msec should be a huge time, isn't it?

 

Thomas Scarbee wrote about pre-delay as a time to put scrapes before real bass note. Also that you have possibility to remove scrapes. It is not latency.
So I guess I accidentally turned off the scrapes and instrument sounds without delay when playing in real time in Maschine.

 

But then whenever you want to record into other tracks, you're getting a delay, so that doesn't really work unless everything else in the session is already finished... (not a great scenario).

According to Scarbee, the latency is necessary in order to make all the scrape sounds work correctly. It's pretty weird, but there it sits. when I use the library in Ableton with the delay set (easy in Live to add a negative delay to any track), everything sounds perfectly in time.

 

33msec is huge, yes. It's very apparent when listening, things sound 'off'. With the negative delay (which apparently can't be setup in Maschine, sadly) everything sounds in time.

Yes, you can turn off scrapes, but then you lose the flavor of the instrument, which is the whole point of using a sample library like this in the first place...they are a major part of the sound, Scarbee himself says they are the "magic sauce".

As far as I am concerned, this Kontakt library is currently not compatible with Maschine until there is some way to appropriately set up the delay offset.

 

While I agree that a track offset would be a welcome feature (would help with orchestral strings and pads too), this isn't really Maschine's "fault" that an instrument has been programmed needing such an offset. Sounds like laziness on the programmer's part i.e., easier to leave the samples needing an offset than to alter all samples to not need it.

 

There is no way to alter the samples to not need it. It's part of the sound. Like you mentioned, there is a similar issue with string sounds, particularly staccato articulations.

Like staccato strings, one way to "quick fix" the situation is to move all the midi notes slightly before the beat by turning the grid "off" and using Maschines "nudge" function.

 

Don't remember having this issue with staccato strings before, but certainly for sustain-type strings with longer attacks this is the quick fix, as you say. Can be particularly irritating at some tempos and pitches when wanting the force of the strings to hit on the first beat of a Pattern due to having to have the notes in the previous Pattern, but needs must and this is the way in Maschine.

 

I apologize for bumping this thread, but I think that someone here may be able to answer my question.
Regarding the Scarbee Rickembacker pre-delay:
Has anyone validated whether -33 ms is the correct offset to use to achieve perfect timing? Is there a procedure to test, without a doubt, that the instrument is set correctly? The idea is to be able to lock the bass with the bass drum. I realized that I have been using -30 instead of -33, which explains why the bass is still a little sluggish to my ear, though that is difficult to confirm. Still, beyond subjective listening I cannot figure exactly to which degree I should offset. Maybe -33 really is the key value in any case.

I am looking forward to a response. Thank you.

 

Check the first post for validation.
Use your ears to check.

 

I did read the first post. 30-33 milliseconds depending on the preset. The problem is that I cannot really hear the difference within such a short range. Is there no mathematical or precise way to measure? Should I look for something in the waveform?

 

You could try and line up the peaks for what it is worth (dump it as audio in a DAW, line it up with other audio tracks). That will probably take ages. I would still use your ears. You've said it yourself you cannot hear the difference. Music is not an exact science. Often perfect = boring. Quirks are often very beneficial. Your time is better spent elsewhere it is your ears you should trust, and then move on.