Samplerate prob in Reaktor

Hello,

I've been having a serious problem with Reaktor in Sonar Home Studio. When I open a project previously saved, my Reaktor plugins come back with a samplerate increased by a factor of two, i.e., if I'm running a samplerate of 96k, the next time I open the project, the reaktor plugins will fire up at 192k, and the second time I reopen, they come back at 384k! I've found a workaround for this, which is to uncheck autosaving, and manually save each plugin at half the samplerate that I wish to bring them up at. Still, does anyone know of a setting that can be changed for this?

 

Yeah, I bumped this. It's so serious that it stands to cost me a lot of money. The workaround that I mentioned above does not work. Whenever I use any Reaktor instrument that uses a sample, each time I save the project and reopen it, the sample has to play at DOUBLE the previous sample rate. Not only does the plugin come back at double the samplerate each time, but the sample apparently HAS to play at that doubled amount. The result of this is that each time that I reopen my project, the cpu load doubles, until the whole thing crashes. Apparently, Sonar Home Studio has no control, over the samplerate of Reaktor, what's going on with the samples I can only guess. I've now been troubleshooting this for 6 hours and I've run out of options. I can't afford to buy a new DAW at this time just for Reaktor. I've spent about 2,000 dollars on my setup, and my cask options are exhausted.

 

Re: Samplerate prob in Reaktor as a plugin in Sonar

ok, can you tell me what happens when you use Reaktor as a standalone.

also are these samples loops, or single hits?

which Reaktor ensembles are you talking about?

also word of advice, if you start a thread about a problem, i think it helps if you mention which host application you are using in the thread tittle

are there any Sonar user out there who can help?

sowari

 

Re: Samplerate prob in Reaktor with sonar home studio 4

Reaktor works fine as a standalone. The problem occurs in all ensembles tested, I've gone through quite a few. It also is present with both dxi and vst versions. I had thought that I could offset the doubling by saving at half the desired samplerate. This worked for ensembles that did not utilize samples. The problem is, when I use an ensemble such as vectory, the sample mangles unless it is played at the doubled rate, making the workaround ineffective. So far the samples have been loops.

 

OK, I dragged out an old copy of Music Creator 2, (I bought it as a cheap and low impact way to add tempo changing and meter changing to Reason 3.0). Reaktor works fine with it. This is definitely a Sonar Home Studio 4 issue. I'd use it if it weren't for the fact that Music Creator is barely a DAW, (it only goes up to 48k on the samplerate, and will only do 16 bit). I'm hoping and praying that there is a setting somewhere that's causing this............

 

btw, you haven't mentioned which soundcard you are using.

sowari

 

An EMU 1212m.

 

Sorry about this. Here are my system specs

Athlon XP 2800+
ASUS a7v8x-x mobo
1 gig pc 2700 RAM
EMU 1212m soundcard
VIA chipset
GForce mx 4000 video card

 

this sounds like a cakewalk issue with home studio. i know you dont want to hear this, but if you cant find a solution, maybe look at cakewalks website at upgrade policy. i know when going from other cakewwalk stuff to either sonar or project 5, they have some decent upgrade pricing. i havent tried any of the newer sonar versions, but from what i hear it is even better than the version i have (2.2), and i must say Sonar 2.2 is a really great DAW, so v4/v5 Sonar is really something that may be worth looking into when your wallet is looking a bit fat! also, project 5 is very nice, i know alot of people put it in the same class as reason, but if you use stuff like Reaktor it is alot better, as you can use VST's. with the groove matrix in V2, it looks liek you can do ableton live-styled stuff, and from my experience with v1, it is a very fast and fun way of working, great for artists who like using/creating MIDI in loop form. also, it looks like v2 can record audio, so it may be worth demoing. i would also suggest ableton live, but since you are already a cakewalk customer, and im thinking money is tight (i know how it is, same exact thing for me), buying cakewalk may be a bit more of a good idea, and they realy are top notch anyways.

also, i hjear cakewalk have good customer support, if you ahevnt yet id try calling/e-mailing them with this problem.

 

Yeah, it does look as though there's nothing that can be done about this at this time. I'll be getting in touch with Cakewalk about it. I've tried just about everything possible! Thanx for the info everybody. Still, I'm nervous about upgrading to a larger version of Sonar with this going on, as Home Studio uses the same engine. I'm thinking on going with Cubase, with some serious research of course. If anyone feels a need to warn me off of that course, feel free! I can use all the info that I can get...

 

i know rachMiel uses Sonar, maybe you should start a new thread asking people for their Sonar experiences with Reaktor.

sowari

 

I'm a Sonar user as well, Phil- another 2.2 user like Daniel who never found a driving reason to upgrade.

Sonar in my experience with it over the past 4 1/2 years has been rock-solid. It doesn't crash, it's easy to work with and I get good results.

ew

 

yes, ew usually has the best advice on sonar/reaktor together, so id trust him. from my experience with cakewalk, as i said before, id really consider sticking with them, for electronic music they really make top-notch softeware, and also it is great for acoustic recordings as well. i personally find myself using it less, but that is only because i have been really into ableton live since v2, and i dont really have enough time to devote to music already to be using both programs (ableton is better for performance-type work, which is more of what im interested in). that said, if given a choice between sonar or cubase only, id pick sonar 10/10 times, i find its whole wrokflow more "quick" and effiecient, and it also has alot of tools for working with loops. cubase has hitpoints, which are like REX files, but i found it alot harder to get work done than with groove clips in sonar. that was in SX1, though, and im sure its improved (i know they have an ableton-like warping engine now). i hear sonar 5 can also import REX-files now, too, and it has the VST wrapper included (since v3), so it really doesnt have anything less than cubase.

even though HS is based on Sonar, ive never heard of anyone else having this problem with Sonar. hopefully it isnt something wrong with your whole setup. please write back here if you find a solution, im interested to see why this has happened.

 

Yes, I'll be looking to check out the Sonar 5 demo if there is one. Problem is that demos don't allow you to save, and the problem with Reaktor occurs when bringing up previously saved work. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Sonar. It runs without a hitch, no pops and clicks, (Cubase anyone?), it syncs everything up perfectly, almost never crashes, and has a marvelous audio engine. The problem is that Sonar Home Studio, which I believe runs the 4.0 engine, (wish I could find out for sure), doesn't run Reaktor properly. I just can't afford to burn $500.00. I will start a thread on Reaktor and Sonar 5 though. Perhaps someone has upgraded to it....

 

have you tried running Sonar Home Studio and Reaktor at 44100 Hz?

please try it and report back what happens when you save and then re-open.

sowari

 

THANKYOU SO MUCH! It is a workaround! I tested it fairly thoroughly and found that I can actually bring the samplerate up to 48k, and it will remain stable. Unfortunately, though, above that, it doesn't seem to work. Both 88 and 96k still display the bug. Still, it is a huge help, as running at the higher samplerate limits the amount the amount of simultaneous plugins anyway. It's a huge help, thankyou very much! I haven't as yet had time to test samples with it yet, though, I've got to run for now, but I've got a suspicion that it will work. I'll report back on the sample situation, but for now I really want to thank you. It's great to have a temporary solution until I can throw some money at the problem!

 

glad it works...but to be honest i am not sure why you want to run your apllication above 48k anyway? are your samples recorded at 88 or 96K? most commercial sample CDs are recorded at 44 and 48k, and so should be played back at those rates. the only things in Reaktor that benefits a higher rate are the synths.

sowari

 

Here's what happened. I had been performing live with Reason 3.0, which has significant aliasing at the lower samplerates. Reason slaves tightly to whatever samplerate is being run on the card, so the EMU DSP would automatically change it's samplerate to match Reason. I had gotten used to running everything at 96k, where I got significantly better sound. Reason also resamples whatever samples that it uses, so running at that was never a problem. Apparently Reaktor doesn't run well in Sonar at anything above 48k, and actually, after doing further research with Cakewalk, I found that they warn about hinky behavior in some plugins above 48k. After further testing, I found that as long as the DAW and soundcard are set at 48k, I can bump Reaktor up to 96k without a problem after inserting it, if I want improved sound quality, but to be honest, it seems like Reaktor holds it's quality quite well at the lower samplerates. The difference in Reason isn't that catastrophic either, and when multitracking, that difference is even less apparent. So I will happily run Sonar at 48k. Thanks again!

 

filter and stuff like that should benifit from higher sample rates too, no? thats why they have oversampled versions. i personally cant see using the higher rates myself, as im always battling CPU overload, but it should still help most ensembles.

 

@ Z, Reaktor has alot of internally oversampled modules i believe, which is why you dont often need to go higher than CD quality to maybe 48K.