The benefits of Maschine : What if I switch to Live/Push ?

So, I’m a Maschine mkII user and I’m solidly considering selling it to buy a Push 2 hardware.

I don’t want to start again a debate about which one is the best between Maschine and Live/Push, nor trying to make a topic about what is cool with Maschine and what is cool with Live/Push. I only use my Maschine mkII for a few of its aspects and I already know that that these two controllers (mkII and Push) are not the same, although they are ultimately used for the same purpose : making music with the best worflow possible.

I only want to know if I can keep the following things with the Push :

1 - When you think of a sound you can get it almost instantly, thanks to the browser that allow me to browse samples and hear them directly, or to also browse for sample packs (groups) or any VST.

2 - When I load a sample or a VST, I can play immediately its base note (usually c3) with others samples/VSTs that are in the same group (16 slots max) or decide to go “deeper” and play the whole pitched scope of the selected sample/VST with my keyboard.

3 - You can, almost immediately, fine tune any sample with all the basic tools provided with the sample. They are tuning, start, reverse, length, filter, envelope and LFO modulation, ...

4 - Sampling with Maschine is very easy, since you can choose between multiple ways of slicing your sample, choose to edit it properly, then you can choose how you are going to use these slices. The first option is to populate 1 slot of a group with all the slices taking the place of the usual pitched duplicates, the second option si tu fill in the 16 slots of a group so you can use any of the 16 selected slices at the desired pitch, independently.

5 - As you have multiple ways of playing your samples, you have multiple ways of triggering them. You may assign a specified length to any sample (AHD) or, when they are all wrapped in one pad, use the ADSR envelope to play each sound the exact same duration of the note played. You also have the legato and choke options, but they are in Live too.

6 - When it’s time tu put some groove, you can specify swing % separately, and in a non destructive way (it’s a parameter you can tweak at any moment), on each level of Maschine : each sound, each group, and the master.

So here is my question : do you know how I can find all these aspects when I’m using Ableton Live with the Push ? The rules are : I’m okay if need to configure my project at first by creating a specific template and use third party plugins, but everything mentioned above must be accessible on the push (1 or 2), so I can keep the same workflow than the one I have with Maschine mkII hardware.

 

You should perhaps ask these questions over at the Ableton forum? I mean there's probably plenty more push users there.

 

I did not because you have to own one of their products in order to participate on their forums...

 

personaly i feel very strongly the call of Push 2 , but i decided to save money for that and get it as soon as i can .
personaly again my relation to music instruments is the one i started with my fisrt guitars ; an instrument become a part of me and there is no way i could cut it or separe myself from so , i conserve my guitars and i will conserve maschine , preciously as myself

and i appreciate deeply this wait that let my imagination dream for a few weeks more , until i make it becoming thrue ...

 

I find it ironic that you start out saying that you feel the pull to buy a Push, but then go on to list 6 Reasons why you like the Maschine. Perhaps if you express the reason that you feel the pull of the other gear, this group might be more helpful.

I can't speak for others, but I often get that urge to get a new piece of gear.

 

HoosierGuy, all the parameters that make me want a Push are very personnal and it wont help anybody if I'm putting it here. I don't need anything else than a comparison between Push and Maschine on these 6 specific points.

 

1 - When you think of a sound you can get it almost instantly, thanks to the browser that allow me to browse samples and hear them directly, or to also browse for sample packs (groups) or any VST.

>>> Sort of. Maschine is definitely better here because everything is tagged, making narrowing down what you're looking for much quicker. It's easy to find WHERE things are on Push 2, but they might just all be in one long list (all your snares for instance) with no way to sort. You can preview samples, drum kits, and instruments from the browse with Push. <<<

2 - When I load a sample or a VST, I can play immediately its base note (usually c3) with others samples/VSTs that are in the same group (16 slots max) or decide to go “deeper” and play the whole pitched scope of the selected sample/VST with my keyboard.

>>> There is no concept of Groups in Live, it doesn't work like that. If you load a VST, it's going to be set up to play with a keyboard. If you load a sample, it's going to be an audio file on the track. Unless you load it in Simpler, then you can play it with a keyboard. (Actually you can play audio clips with a keyboard in Live too, but we'll skip that for now). <<<

3 - You can, almost immediately, fine tune any sample with all the basic tools provided with the sample. They are tuning, start, reverse, length, filter, envelope and LFO modulation, ...

>>> yes. <<<

4 - Sampling with Maschine is very easy, since you can choose between multiple ways of slicing your sample, choose to edit it properly, then you can choose how you are going to use these slices. The first option is to populate 1 slot of a group with all the slices taking the place of the usual pitched duplicates, the second option si tu fill in the 16 slots of a group so you can use any of the 16 selected slices at the desired pitch, independently.

>>> Since this wasn't a question, I won't answer <<<

5 - As you have multiple ways of playing your samples, you have multiple ways of triggering them. You may assign a specified length to any sample (AHD) or, when they are all wrapped in one pad, use the ADSR envelope to play each sound the exact same duration of the note played. You also have the legato and choke options, but they are in Live too.

>>> waiting for a question..... I bet it's coming soon! <<<

6 - When it’s time tu put some groove, you can specify swing % separately, and in a non destructive way (it’s a parameter you can tweak at any moment), on each level of Maschine : each sound, each group, and the master.

>>> Still no question! Look into Live's manual at the section on Grooves, it's way more powerful than just swing, though there is a global swing in Live too. <<<

 

for #2. can't you just drop instruments or whatever you want into a rack and set up the rack like maschine's groups?

 

Yes, or you could use drum racks. But it's not a fundamental way of organizing things in Live was my point, the concept isn't inherent to the way the program works like it is in Maschine.

 

Hello tarekith, thanks for taking your time for this
Actually none of these points are questions, it's juste statements : I do this with Maschine, can I do the same with the Push ?

I think my biggest fear is to lose that versatily you get in Maschine with that toggle between groups of sounds ("fingerdrumming mode") and the kayboard layout (melodic mode).

 

Well, sounds like you have a pretty good handle on what you need and what the downsides/positives are to either workflow. Now you just have to make up your mind if it's worth that leap

 

I think he is going on saying that he likes these aspects because he already owns these aspects in the current software he's using and wants to make sure that the workflow will be similar and he won't lose any functionality that he is used to. Makes sense. He is basically asking if anyone around here knows that these features exist in the software and hardware in question that he wishes to purchase. Makes sense to me.

 

Thanks for the set up Terekith I'll try to give my 2 cents but I am no expert but have been using Live for about 7 years.

1 - When you think of a sound you can get it almost instantly, thanks to the browser that allow me to browse samples and hear them directly, or to also browse for sample packs (groups) or any VST.

>>>I would say not so much, but the best way to do this is to make folders and label them as you would tags all though you aren't going to be able to get more then one tag I have folder designated for one shots and within that folder I have kicks, snares, hats, bass shots, synth shots etc. then I can drop those into Ableton browser and I find it just as fast or faster to find a sound but of course the set up is a long process but worth it. . Again I use the AudioModders .adg's to get all the Maschine Sounds into a drum rack quickly so you don't bitterly have to start up a whole new collection of sounds or not be able to use Maschine Samples, then you can also use your MKII to tune truncate your drums etc. just like normal

Here is a video that shows how quick browsing is..



here is how I have my folders set up with personal samples etc.


and There is also a 128 rack in the new Ableton update I have heard but haven't tried yet. 128 kicks 128 snares hats etc and all browsable and loadable through the twist of a knob in real time. I have also made one of these drum racks with Maschine Library and its kind of cool to an extent. Or you go and copy out the Maschine Library to other folders just don't screw up your Library.

<<<

2 - When I load a sample or a VST, I can play immediately its base note (usually c3) with others samples/VSTs that are in the same group (16 slots max) or decide to go “deeper” and play the whole pitched scope of the selected sample/VST with my keyboard.

>>> You can mimic a machine style Group by grouping as many channels as you want or rack things up and nest them together in an instrument rack to play them all at once or enable multiple record buttons on the tracks to record on all them at once. This defiantly won't be the same or feel the same but these are not the same softwares or hardwares or course. Once in a group you can launch as many clips as you want on that group level vertically.. meaning more then one on the group but only one per "sound" aka channel. <<<

3 - You can, almost immediately, fine tune any sample with all the basic tools provided with the sample. They are tuning, start, reverse, length, filter, envelope and LFO modulation, ...

>>> Easily and just as fast as Maschine guaranteed. <<<

4 - Sampling with Maschine is very easy, since you can choose between multiple ways of slicing your sample, choose to edit it properly, then you can choose how you are going to use these slices. The first option is to populate 1 slot of a group with all the slices taking the place of the usual pitched duplicates, the second option si tu fill in the 16 slots of a group so you can use any of the 16 selected slices at the desired pitch, independently.

>>> Definitely not the same as Maschine and that is one feature that can be slightly missed by us users but you can slice and convert to drum rack and then dive into each cell's simpler to edit the individual hits by hand but I don't think it as detailed as Maschine's samplers of course. Hopefully there will be a Simpler>Sampler option soon from the Push 2 hardware. BTW you do get these pages Main, Global, Envelopes, WARP, Filter, LFO and Pan... quite a bit of options honestly. Thats definitely one thing I will miss is that you can't really slice then play each slice at the desired pitch from the hardware but you can tune each slice to what ever note you want and you get up to 64 pads to do this on and you can do it fast and easy with the duplicate button. <<<

5 - As you have multiple ways of playing your samples, you have multiple ways of triggering them. You may assign a specified length to any sample (AHD) or, when they are all wrapped in one pad, use the ADSR envelope to play each sound the exact same duration of the note played. You also have the legato and choke options, but they are in Live too.

>>> There is copy value to siblings that isn't accessible from the hardware but hey maybe in the future..
<<<

6 - When it’s time to put some groove, you can specify swing % separately, and in a non destructive way (it’s a parameter you can tweak at any moment), on each level of Maschine : each sound, each group, and the master.

>>> Nope only destructive groove unless its global, but I like it that way! You can do different percentage values per MIDI note of course. <<<

I think you may have asked about effecting each slice independently ?
Here St. Joe shows ya how this could be done.

 

This is not a Ableton support forum. Go to Ableton forums for support or new purchase questions. There is already a general thread on the Push 2 here.