X2 F1's and an S4 MK3

Hi All,
Looking for some help!
Just updated my Traktor set-up to an S4 MK3 and decided to link up X2 F1's to complete the new system. However, the functionality of the F1's don't quite match my expectations as described below:

I have connected both F1's via a USB hub directly into my S4 (hub connection). I have imported the NI Step sequencer add-on and also imported a third party Midi Mapping (tekken's ultimate F1 effects mapping).
My hope with this new set up was 2 fold.
In user mode I can control channel A/B with track decks through the S4. For the F1's I want to control - channel C as step sequencer F1(1), then channel D as remix deck F1(2)
For some reason, the step sequencer is very glitchy and both F1's will either play as step sequencer or remix decks? Is this because I am routing both F1's through the same hub? Or are there settings in the control manager that I would need to adjust?

In midi mode, I wanted to use 4 track decks through the S4 and use both F1's as effects units, using the tekken mapping. F1(1) on page 1 F1(2) on page 2 of the midi map.
The issue I have here is that only 1 F1 will allow me to assign the effects channel (mute buttons mapped to assign effects lit up on 1 F1 only - second F1 has no functionality)
Again is this because I have both F1's routed through the same hub or settings set incorrectly)?

There maybe a simple explanation to allow me to use the F1's as I planned, or I may have been wishing for something that is just not possible...Any help would be appreciated. Cheers

 

I have had the same issue. Unfortunately the F1 step sequencer can not be used very well together with a second F1 running mapping. I have given up on this idea. Now I use one F1 to run effects mapping and the other one just as remix deck controller, although this does not happen very much.
The text below is the answer from NI on a ticket regarding this issue. This text has not been edited in any way and is shown in full.

It was really not easy to get hold of these information, since NI has recently let go of roughly 100 people across all offices and this has made it tricky to get hold of the correct people for certain questions.

But some one of the developers which has been involved with the Kontrol F1 and its integration was able to shed some light on this topic.

When the F1 first cam out, it was purely designed as a Remix Deck Controller in its default mapping, with the possibility to switch to either the "MIDI Mode" (Generic Midi) OR to the "USER Mode" (also a NHL mapping, like the default)

This switch between these modes works without issues and the Kontrol F1 was designed with this in mind.

Several years later the "Step Sequencer" mode was born, out of a NI internal "Hack Day" event and some of our developers (Which sadly are not here anymore) found a clever solution on how the Remix Decks can be used for Step Seqencing.

However, since this was and is more or less a "hack" - the option to reliably switch between the Default and the Step Sequencer Mapping was seemingly not implemented and the controller allocation does not work in a reliable and comprehensible way.

The colleague i was talking to also mentioned that it was not designed to be used together with regular Remix Sets, since the Step Sequencer relies on short "one-shot" samples and a Remix Deck on longer loops or samples, that play and loop or only play once.

So in reality, the few users who do use Remix Decks and Step Sequencers in the same setup, do not switch between the modes, they use a Remix Deck on one side and the Step Sequencer setup on the other and keep it this way.

I have also asked if there would be a possibility to change this behaviour and improve the controller allocation after switching, but since there is so little demand from other users, the effort to rework the Step Sequencer implementation would be extremely time consuming and there are sadly other, higher prioritized features and bug fixes on the TP3 roadmap first.

I am really sorry that you a.) had to wait for such a long time to get this answer and b.) that there is no solution for this topic - so i guess if this workflow is really essential for you, adding a third party device to your setup that does what you need it to might be a good idea.

 

Hi Tijn,
Thank you for you're reply. Much appreciated!
It makes sense that the step sequencer add in doesn't work as well, considering the F1's we're not designed to support this action. I will think about getting third party hardware if I want to go down this route in the future.

With regards to running the F1's as a remix deck + efx unit, I am having issues with this. Sometimes the remix decks play but but no sound comes through the channel. I presume that the output routing needs adjustment? But for some reason the output routing in control manager has been greyed out and unavailable for changing? (I think this has happened since importing the step sequencer add-in)

Do you also know if it is possible to run the X2 F1's as efx units in midi mode? I want to run P1 of the mapping on 1 F1 and P2 of the mapping on the other F1.

Thanks again for your reply.

 

The F1 has noting to do with the output routing. It controls one or two decks and should be plug and play. For me importing the step sequencer mapping has not given any issues with no sound coming out. The controller manager does has nothing to do with the output routing either. Without seeing your output routing in the preferences it is hard to tell want is not set correctly. These are mine


I also set my F1 to midi mode in the preferences. This way both the mapping and the remix deck controls work.


Running two F1's with both a different mapping should not be a problem. Have not done it myself. Planning to map my Maschine Jam to control both the remix decks and running my effects mapping so I have only one extra controller.

NI writes this on the F1 product page about the step sequencer. If it is "just" result of a hack day and the workings are nor reliable then do not advertise it on your product page.

 

Hi, once again, thank you for your swift and detailed response. With regards to the output routing, I did not describe my issue correctly. I was referring to the "Out-port" routing within control manager / device set up. For some reason this was not available to set. I have now done some tinkering and got it set correctly. Both the remix decks and efx are now working correctly. Thank you very much for your help.

Jury is still out on whether I can get both F1's set as efx units.... I note that you advised using 2 separate mappings for each F1. Do you know where I can get any other good TSI files for any other midi maps for efx? I can then give this a try.
Thanks once more for your response and advice.

 

This is the point where I misunderstood you. Reading back I see you want Page1 on F1-1 and Page2 on F1-2, where Page1 and Page 2 are both in the same mapping file. This will not be possible. You can assign the mapping only to one F1. Giving both F1's the same name in the controller editor (seperate program) will not help because they just will be synced. When you go to Page1 on F1-1, F1-2 will also go to Page 2.
But on the other hand you can run multiple mapping files on one F1.
See in the beginning of this video with two F1's, one effects mapped and one remix deck controller. The white F1 is running 5 mapping files at the same time.


There are many mapping files to be found on different forums and websites. Check DJ Tech Tools for example https://maps.djtechtools.com/mappings?search[software_id]=29

 

Hi Thanks again for your response, I will check out the other mapping files to see if there is any other ones I like the look of.
You have been a great help, thank you for coming back to me with all your information

 

You are welcome, glad to be helpfull.
If you like a challenge you can map your favorite effects from the other effects mappings yourself to one (or more) mapping file(s).

 

Hi, that's great will defo give it a go. Thanks again for all your help