Xone:DB4

Push +1

 

Moving on

I can't really add to the argument on scratch certification other than to say I support it and it's nonsense (I would go with the most intelligent argument and bombard NI, as opposed to using the term "nonsense").

Instead, I'd rather talk about the possibilities of the DB4. Seems to me like this mixer is, out-of-the-box, the best mixer available for sound quality, effects, and overall build quality. What is getting me really excited (and more willing to drop $3k) is the expandability and upgrade potential. Correct me if I am wrong here, but given that all of the effects are routed through the '5 categories' and not fixed to knobs, encoders, etc that A&H could provide additional effects, refinements, and more (I don't claim to know what is able to be adjusted, added or removed).

What could be done with the X-Link? I am disappointed that there's no 5-pin midi out. You can workaround it in the computer, routing the midi out from the mixer but what information is capable of being sent from the DB4? CC and note info obviously but what about bpm? fader and x-fader info? Could the X-Link be used as a way to send midi data out?

I'm interested as we do visuals with our music and sending midi information from either controllers or Traktor itself to the visuals man is part of our future plans.

I realize that certification is huge and is part of a healthy product including future development of features based on the amount of units sold. I don't want to get away from the current direction but by discussing where this mixer could go we are also encouraging NI to get on board. Currently there isn't much information out there, reviews are limited, and first hand experience with the DB4 is scant please let people know how amazing this mixer is.

 

Ro-Tunder, I think the X-link may offer a further midi control over network connection separate to how it currently sends and receives midi over USB...but you have to set-it up with the program to be controlled and not necessarily on the DB4. Also, I learned a little bit more about A&H and this unit, and as time goes on they may release more effects in new OSs. Additionally, this is not mass produced mixer, built by hand, all in the UK and not like the Pioneer units are built on Six sigma assembly lines by elves in the back of Guitar Centers.

They also may be onto something better than just a mixer to be certified for Traktor scratch pro and it may not be fully realized in this version of the product but it's currently far superior to anything else on the market these days. To have time code control over USB is the missing potential right now but you can do it with a NI soundcard that makes the DB4's soundcard unusable (pointless set-up). This mixer already has great potential as a digital mixer for midi controlling and soundcard for Traktor Pro and and also with vinyl or other analog sources.

One of the most un-talked about features of the DB4 is the four bpm read-outs that show up in the channel effects window. Yes, it's a beneficial feature for those who work with analog sources not sync'd by a midi clock.... specifically, with vinyl! I ended the last hour of my two hour set using all vinyl gems from my collection and purchases this week and was amazed at how accurate I am once I had the ability to check it on the DB4. I didn't realize that I could use this as well because the mind gets clogged up with digital these days being so easy to use and adapt your vinyl skills with. Naturally when I mix with vinyl, it's matched up and cue'd to a execution position that's based on song position memory - with Waves you can jump to bars and execute somewhere with markers but not with vinyl. You play a portion of the song and then set a cue point and wait or ride until the position of the outgoing song is ready to be released. You can use all these tools with digital like harmonic mixing and sync stuff but with vinyl it's ears, memory, skills and execution. I've never had the ability to check how accurate I was because I just go on feel of the mix and the song takeover thinking it is just "on" and when I switched off the midi bpm function on the DB4 to a range bpm range halfway through the set I began to look over for effects to execute on time and saw that my skills were putting me consistently within .1 near a locked match (vinyl shifts sometimes so that's great - you just have to ride it on pitch, spindle pinch and slide platter brake). With digital you don't need to do that because of the midi clocks or sync to master in DVS. I continue working with vinyl and don't have the timecode disc control but only realized that you can't see that comparison info side by side with a Pioneer or even in Traktor Pro (because thru sources don't pick up bpm in TP). When using vinyl you don't carry a bpm checker like a nerd so you need those natural fundamentals (and most importantly the photographic memory that translates to tune selection) to make it work. However, the DB4 puts the information right there and.....that little information can help. I'm not saying I am or have ever mixed on straight bpms - I'm saying that the little bit of information is a checker for your skills and it helps because I'm able to add effects on time and full bars of loops at the end or intro of song - on beat- and that can go on for a while until it actually falls off time.

So, it has strengths relevant for clock/midi sync'd sources and can be great for working with things that don't rely upon controlled sync.

Also, I'm experimenting with this one but have to pass on that the duplicate channel selector switching only allows pick up on the original pre- 'live' input source and cannot double touch on a internal post 'capture' such as a loop or effected playback of the original source. In other words, if two or more channels are selected to one sound source and one rolls a loop of the original, the other selected to the input can only grab what is coming in the physical plug and not what is bouncing around in the mixer. You can do a trick by playing the live audio on its original channel, grab loops and add effects on the other channels (like during a break) and ride the original until it returns or be skillful, stop the original source, back it up and cue it up to throw back in when you are done with the captures.

 

Why has the Xone 4D been certified and not the DB4?

Come on NI, it doesn't seen like you are listening to your customers again. just like you didn't listen to us about the issues with Traktor 1 and now 2 not being able to ready Asian characters in iTunes playlists, that are still not fixed after 3 years of updates and new versions!

NI Sort it out please...
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BTW i love my Xone 4d

 

Think the xlink is so they can plug new versions of the 1D into it and that way it'd rant take up a USB port on the computer

 

The 4D received scratch certification when it was the top dawg....but we're not getting closer to resolution with NI on issues by raising them in the forum because pretty much no corporate response has occurred here just like in topics about HID support for CDJs. Since there's no fully capable alternative we're all just waiting in line expecting them to fix these on top of all of the other reported issues. Quite simply, some things may never work and may'be we have to deal with it or find another solution to keep the music going.

I hate to say it but we didn't feel like this when Pro 1 was released and you'd only expect things that should be working now in version 2 would have been fixed. It's kind of messed up if they did rush this one out without a clear end in sight for some of the overdue issues but the DB4 certification may be complicated by new technology. TP2 has only been out for over a month.... Yet, for the sake of belief in NI (and in praise of their other products I love) I just hope they get around to it and do something major that lets the users know they were listening and had our interests in mind.

 

Hi to all DB4-owners out there!

I finally got my unit and messed around with it the last days. I primary want to work with TP2 and have a problem with it.

Does anybody know, how to Sync the DB4 to Trakor over Midi? I don't receive tempoinformation in the DB4. I enabled "Send Midi Clock" in Traktor's settings and mastersection. I setted BPM-Mode in the DB4 to midi. What else do I have to to?
I have this problem with TP1 and TP2. From Ableton Live I receive the midiclock immediately.

Any suggestions?

 

Behringer DDM 4000 will get NI-Certification due to a high projection of
units being sold in the first 24 months...

 

Nasty noise here are instructions someone posted to the DJTT board about doing this with the DDM4000; I have no idea if this will work for the DB4 but it's worth a try and I'm curious as I am thinking of buying one eventually...

1) Hook up MIDI cables from DDM4000 to soundcard/MIDI input
2) Run a cable from an output on your soundcard to an input on your soundcard (soundcard must be multi-client capable on Windows, I have an audio 10)
3) In Traktor, change your input routings for decks 3 & 4 (sample decks) to that input
4) In Traktor, create a generic MIDI device with input from your soundcard/MIDI input
5) In Traktor, go to the Master clock section and click 'Ext'
6) In Maschine, go into MIDI routings and change the MIDI input port from your soundcard/MIDI input to 'Yes'
7) In Maschine go into the 'File' menu and click 'Sync to External clock'
8) In Traktor, change the deck you want to use for Maschine (you can switch whenever you like) to 'Live Input'.
9) Click the MIDI clock start button on your DDM

10) PROFIT

 

Nasty Noise,

-No midi cables required - hook usb from DB4 to computer.

-Inside Traktor, create generic clock device in Traktor (watch one of DJ Endo's sync Traktor to Machine videos).

-Inside Traktor, change Traktor sound card set-up to DB4 and hook up channels internally while realigning decks to layout on DB4 by selecting deck routing as follows: Deck A(USB 3/4) Deck B (USB 5/6) Deck C(USB1/2) Deck D (USB 7/8).

-Inside DB4 change the USB channel routings to "Send Digital"
aligned with traktor deck set-up which in the physical lay out will be C-A-B-D.

-In DB4 change bpm set-up to "MIDI" not a bpm range so it'll stay in sync

-Download MixArkitect's tsi file (another posted forum topic) and import settings BY ADD to the generic
Traktor Clock you created midi set-up. (be careful as to do this isn't a straight tsi import it's an add from the top section where you'd name midi files)*read up on this or you will overwrite the "clock" send you created.

-Reboot Traktor - should be working.

-Inside Traktor, configure on screen deck lay-out the way you need it but review midi clock is at top of lay-out (really only required if you are synching other programs internal to computer which is shown in
the DJEndo videos).

-Test and Learn mixarkitect's set-up by provided PDF.

Did I miss something?
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- Please stop talking about DDM4000 here. Do that in another forum about that mixer and not the DB4.

 

Thanks to all for your hints!
finally I got it work.
I have checked out many setting- and konfigurationstuff the last days in TP and DB4. During that I probably checked or unchecked and necessary option for midi-sync...but dont ask me which

Yesterday I repeated all steps from Traktor TP2's useguide (chapter "sync external hardware to traktor") and after that it works.

Now I have all functions/features running I need/want to work with (at the moment).

Cant wait until the weekend begins to stars the first mixes :lol:

I'm working with TP2 (4 decks), DB4 and 2 Kontrol X1. I have spend the last evenings to configurate the X1s and the DB4. It was allot to do but also allot of fun. I like this configuration-stuff, but i'm always happy, when its done and i finally can start to "work"

First at all im happy, that everything that was in my mind the last weeks/months has become reality and seems to work how it was in my mind. Now I have to check out, if this is what I truly want ;-)

And here my weekend give-away for you:

/watch?v=GR8jOJZERhs&feature=fvwrel
(append to tube)

king regards

 

my tsi for traktor 2 + db4 can be found here:
http://www.mixarchitekt.com/teknik/MixArchitekt-XoneDB4_TP201_tsi-v14.zip

and thanks to running out of space for having so many interesting things to say about your journey with the DB4. it gives back as much as you put into it!

 

.

pfff....is this forum buggy or does NI delete my posts? ...writing this post for the 4th time now...

to make it short: i fixed the problem.
it seems that I have played around a little bit too much with the trakor-settings the last days. yesterday i repeated all steps from traktors user guide (sync external hardware to traktor) and after this, everything works fine and as expected.

thanks to all of you and happy enjoying the this awesome machine!

nasty

 

Hi Nasty_Noise,

Welcome to the forum.

Sometimes your post goes into automatic moderation if the automated script thinks there's something fishy.

I have now approved your post.

 

Thanks for the information Zero....next time i'll know. Do you know what was "fishy" in my post?...its interessting to know for avoiding this problem in the future.

regards

 

Example: Simple 1- bar loop - looped on the DB4, add effects and use the channel EQ/ISO etc + filters.

Nothing to do with any program - all done on the DB4 and may'be a bad example that scratches upon the surface of what it's capable of but this is just one channel of effected stuff that I can put online without getting sued. It would be nice to let you hear the rest of the stuff going on but don't worry... I will post more examples soon that will let you hear more differences in the effects and with different timings too.

Don't fret about the timings of delays. It's deliberate to show you the offset differences when applied without jumping the divisions.

The favorite is the reverse effect that isn't actually a reverse loop sample playback like on Pioneers. This effect adds sound rhythmic to beats and makes it a little bit greater.

http://snd.sc/iBnBlH

 

Unless you're using TSP for vinyl control why use traktor at all?

Rekordbox + CDJs + DB4 = dream setup

You have all the looping and effects you could ever need so why hassle plugging a laptop in?

Have my CDJs, saving up for a DB4!

 

No I have no idea what the parameters are.

 

I think the primary reason is that Traktor offers much better music collection management than Rekordbox. Rekordbox is clunky, at best. It works..... but is definitely lagging behind most other options in the marketplace.

Another reason to use Traktor....
Let's assume you have a basic home DJ setup with a DJ Mixer, and 2 CDJ-2000 players. You have one track playing on CDJ #1, and you now want to preview several tracks as possible choices for your next mix. You decide on a track to mix next and you cue it up on the CDJ #2. Now maybe you have 30 seconds of free time you would like to use by previewing more music for the upcoming mixes in your set. Unless you have a Pioneer DJM-2000 mixer, or one of the other new Pioneer mixers that interface with Rekordbox.... then you cannot preview any more music until you have completed your mixout. The only way to have a preview deck would be to purchase another CDJ-2000 player. YIKES!
This is one of the reasons why professional DJs will have minimum of 3 CDJ-2000s in their contract riders. Without a 3rd deck, you can't Cue a track and then Preview another.

In Traktor, you have a free Preview Deck available in the software. Certainly a much cheaper alternative to buying a 3rd CDJ Player.

 

it's even cheaper to learn your tracks inside out - it will make you a better dj too.
it's also part of the 'craft' of djing and not something you can do with the click of a button - the pro dj's know their record box's.

also, rekordbox & the cdjs have a tag system which allows to add various tracks to a temporary 'crate' throughout the night, as & when you get chance to audition other suitable tracks.