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Kontakt Format Libraries ?

Discussion in 'KONTAKT' started by muziksculp, Dec 2, 2002.

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  1. muziksculp

    muziksculp Forum Member

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    29
    Hi,

    Kontakt is able to import other format libraries, (Akai, EXS24, Giga, Halion, SDII,...etc.) while this is great, it could also be a factor in slowing down the development of a Kontakt native format.

    I notice that the Kontakt format is not mentioned at this time in many commercial sample library developer's web sites, this will hopefuly change as more users demand a Kontakt format. I do realize that Kontakt is a fairly young sample format, and needs to mature, on the other hand if there are developers that are currently offering the Kontakt format, where are they ? maybe a link to these developers on the N.I. website will be useful.

    Can we say that the Kontakt translation/Import of these other formats is 100% perfect ? or are Kontakt users at a disavantage until Kontakt becomes a standard format offered by many sound library developers ?

    For example, the "Vienna Symphonic Library" more info. at (www.vsl.com.at) or (www.ilio.com) will be available soon in Giga, and EXS24 formats, this is a huge orchestral library, streaming from HD is a must ! so, once Kontakt is able to stream from HD, can we say that we can work with the EXS24/Giga format, or is a Kontakt format of this library a must ? This is not a cheap library, (will be available on DVD and HD ) so I will not be risking the purchase of the EXS24 or Giga format, only to notice that it doesn't translate perfectly into Kontakt.

    I was told by VSL that they might consider a Kontakt format next year, but no guarantees that they will, so here is this issue again, is the Kontakt format going to take-off as a standard format, or are we suposed to guess if we can import sample libraries in other formats perfectly ?

    My main use for a sampler wheather software or hardware based, is primarily to emulate real acoustic instruments, and not to reproduce a Moog, or other electronic/synthetic sounds, so I hope to see more high quality Acoustic Instrument libraries for Kontakt.

    Any thoughts on this subject ?


    Thanks.

    -----------
  2. deengdawng

    deengdawng New Member

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    6
    This is the way A LOT of people feel..

    I am in the exact same boat you are. I just ordered Kontakt..it's in the mail as we speak. As I look around at all the 5-star libraries I see most are in Giga or Akai format. I figured that this would be no problem since NI advertises that Kontakt imports all the major formats...until I started reading posts about import problems. If I experience too many problems I'll sell it. Basically, for me, whichever soft-sampler is able to accurately translate Giga samples first gets my money. Except for Gigastudio itself of course...way too much of a hassle to purchase and build a whole new computer and learn how to set it up for two months. As long as I'm posting, I should also say that NI really needs to pick up their customer service relations. I've emailed them simple questions before and never received a single response. I also see that they don't post on the forums that often either. These things put everyone off. So NI, if you're listening, please make the Kontakt update KICK ASS and attend these forums more often and you'll have a loyal, $$$ spending customer.
  3. bduffy

    bduffy NI Product Owner

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    1,801
    I just want to point out that there are some custom settings (Dimensions, internal FX) for Giga formats that will probably never be able to be imported 100% perfectly by a sampler other then Gigasampler, so you shouldn't expect fully perfect imports.

    Personally, I've never had a major problem with AKAI imports. On one string collection (Miroslav Strings, I think), a couple of patches' ADSR settings were wrong, but that's easily adjusted in Kontakt. Seeing as I usually need to adjust ADSR settings to suit my needs anyway, it didn't bother me too much; I think it's great that you have the option of importing these formats, and I can trade off a little user-editing time in order to be able to use these powerful AKAI collections. I've done plenty of symphonic arrangements with Kontakt and am very happy with the results.

    I've even had a pretty easy time of importing Giga samples (and editing them down to a reasonable size). They often come in with strange LFO settings (I think the internal Giga FX settings), but you just delete the LFO module and everything's fine.

    So I wouldn't say Kontakt is at a distinct disadvantage here. I'm sure Kontakt libraries will start emerging soon; it's far too powerful a sampler to be ignored - although I find it strange how quickly the HALion was embraced by sample library companies!?

    Thanks,
  4. coredump

    coredump Forum Member

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    167
    akai import

    Never had a single problem here.

    In fact because of the (practically) unlimited memory on the pc working with kontakt and importing akai libraries is a lot easier than working with an s3000 - even fully expanded:)

    What I have done with my akai library is just saved them all into kontakt format as I hate the sound of the cd-rom spinning up and I have lots of disk space.
  5. Spirit

    Spirit Forum Member

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    242
    Yes, the whole format question is a bit of a worry. I'm still debating whether to get Voices of the Apocalypse (US$500). NI say it *should* be OK and will be *better* when streaming is added, but for $500 I need to be a little more certain than that.

    Certainly more Kontakt format libraries, or even an NI approved library list of compatible sounds would be a huge help.
  6. muziksculp

    muziksculp Forum Member

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    Steinberg gives Halion Strings library!

    Hi,

    Talking about Kontakt format libraries, Steinberg is offering Halion users a high quality strings library, halion format for Halion users, now this is what I would like to see N.I. sound development and support for Kontakt to begin doing, we need quality libraries in Kontakt format!

    Halion can read akai, Giga, and other formats, but that doesn't mean that Halion users feel they have to rely on these other format, and play the guessing game of how they will sound once imported.

    Bravo Steinberg !

    N.I. we are waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting,......
  7. bduffy

    bduffy NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,801
    "Bravo, Steinberg"?

    Hm. Makes me wonder why you bought Kontakt in the first place; we all new it was a brand new product, trying to break into an established market. Did you expect all the companies to just fall in line and spend the money/R&D to convert their libraries to a brand new format?

    NI is a smaller company than Steinberg; they don't have as much money to go and record that full symphony JUST FOR YOU next week.

    The market is saturated with amazing string/symphony samples already! I use Miroslav and Garritan Strings in Kontakt, with results that just floor me. Kontakt may not be getting immediate support for its native format - but it supports ALL the major formats, including your precious HALion format; I don't see the problem here. Sure, sometimes you have to tweak an incorrectly translated parameter - but if you're afraid of tweaking, why do you have a sampler?

    HALion users do have to put up with a lousy interface that is only accepted because it has the Steinberg logo on it. I think we all chose Kontakt because we saw that it offered the best of both the software and hardware worlds, and that we knew it was something special. The industry does SEEM to be a little slow to embrace the format; but don't speak to soon - for all we know, there are scores of companies designing their libraries for Kontakt. Or maybe they're just so impressed that Kontakt can import all the major formats, that they realise that they don't have to translate them, as they already WORK in Kontakt. I wasn't able to use AKAI or Giga libraries before I bought Kontakt - now I can, and my music is better for it!

    "Bravo, Native Instruments", I say!
  8. muziksculp

    muziksculp Forum Member

    Messages:
    29
    Well, I am not expecting any miracles here, I am just a user who invested in a product like Kontakt for its advaced features, ease of use, MacOS/MAS/Freemidi support, and eventually the availablity of sound libraires that are Kontakt native.

    I feel that a sampler sounds its best and is most reliable in reading programs, when it loads its native format.

    Steinberg is a company that has most likely given its customers what they had requested. What's wrong with that? Plus remember, Kontkat can read the Halion format, so Kontkat users will also benefit from this.

    Now it could take some time for the native Kontakt format to become more widely available, but the pace at which this happens will only be speeded up with more feedback from users requesting the native format to become a reality. (I am sure we will see more Kontakt libraries come alive)

    It is great that Kontakt seems to do a wonderful job at reading other formats, I agree N.I. are on the right track (Bravo!). and so are Kontkat users, so the bottom line is let's make a great software sampler even better by offering users a wide selection of choices as far as the libraries are concerned, make HD streaming a useful option to load bigger samples than what RAM offers, and maybe the N.I. engineers will even come up with some newer more sophisticated features in future upgrades - The future of Kontakt looks bright !

    ------
  9. bduffy

    bduffy NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,801
    Nice - that's a more positive article!

    There's nothing wrong with Steinberg giving their customers what they want; Apple and Emagic probably takes care of Logic users, but I'm a SONAR/VST user - why should I care?. Besides, if their String library is SO wonderful, I can use it in Kontakt already.

    Perhaps we need to be reminding companies like East West, Yellow Tools, Zero-G, Ilio etc that they are neglecting a growing market - these are the companies that put out the real meticulous stuff that we desire - and they're stuck thinking HALion and EXS-24 are the only samplers out there!

    In fact, I'm going to contact (no pun intended) some of these companies today and see what they have to say. It is quite stunning how sample publishers are failing to take notice!

    Regards,
  10. bduffy

    bduffy NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,801
    Just wanted to share what Zero-G had to say about Kontakt:
    So it looks like (for now) everyone is relying on Kontakt's importing strength, rather than its own format.

    later
  11. dfloyd

    dfloyd Forum Member

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    109
    Sweet Talk VSL please

    I can't believe the VSL folks are formating their library for EXS24, and not for Kontakt. Someone at Emagic must have sweet talked someone at VSL. I've been using Logic for over 10 years, and have been a tester for them for over a year. The Exs24mkII is very disapointing. Only been improved a couple of time since it was introduced, and then nothing that users & us testers had been begging for was implemented.

    Their editor is absolutely horrible. What a waste of time for VSL, to be porting their library over to a sample player that only works with Logic, and only runs on a Mac. Emagic will let them down, IMHO.

    Please NI, get on the phone, and start sweet talking VSL, and get this serious serious library ported over to Kontakt. Get the key switching happening, and get that library for us, please.

    thanks so much,
    dfloyd
  12. skwids

    skwids Forum Member

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    26
    Yo Dfloyd! What's up dude? We were just talking about you. Rob was going to email you and send the love. Thanks again for helping us at NAMM (Dfloyd can play folks). We uploaded some pictures from the show. Email me and I'll give you a link.

    Oh yeah, and we need to send you a Sonic Station for your Kontakt and stop complaining about VSL!!! Who cares??? (just kidding).

    Peace!
  13. dfloyd

    dfloyd Forum Member

    Messages:
    109
    Hey Man,

    Sounds like you'd be a great guy to know, but I think you have me confused with another "dfloyd". Did you check my site? Anyways, I don't think I know what you're talking about. But I do remember you were supposed to send me that "Sonic Station"......hahaha. just kidding.

    kind regards,
    david

    PS
    E-mail me privately if you want my address to mail me that package:eek:)
  14. cosmic

    cosmic Forum Member

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    36
    Kontact Support is coming.

    Well I know that Sonic implants is working on a
    release for a Kontact supported String library and Big Fish audio have said that all there new sample library's will support Kontact.
    I wouldn't be suprised if others followed suit when they
    realise how popular it is. Kontact is the best hands down it cant be ignored!!


    Peace.
  15. dfloyd

    dfloyd Forum Member

    Messages:
    109
    Mirosalv glitches

    HOw about the FHorns# (not FF), on the lowest octave. Do you hear freaky stuff on the loop, as it begins to glitch, and other notes play as it glitches, and if you continue to hold the note there, Kontakt crashes. Have you had that on the Miroslav Brass/Woodwinds?

    kind regards,
    /d
  16. bduffy

    bduffy NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,801
    NO! The horns work as well as the strings on my end, unless I just haven't used that particular patch before - what's the exact name of the patch? Do you mean the solo instruments?
  17. dfloyd

    dfloyd Forum Member

    Messages:
    109
    No, FR HORNS #, from the Miroslav Brass/Woodwinds edition. The lowest multisample on that patch. Hold it out until the loop starts. Does that work ok there? IF so, then maybe I need to re-convert that one, 'cause it's a problem here.

    thanks,
    /d
  18. bduffy

    bduffy NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    1,801
    No, I don't recall having any problems like that; just some ADSR adjustments and I think one trumpet patch seemed to be out of tune a little bit.

    I haven't used the CDs since I've converted them to nki, and I don't have the CDs here, so I can't test it to be sure, sorry. I do love the French Horns, so I'm sure that I've converted that particular patch. I tend to use FH LONG FF/PP most of the time, though.

    Every sample library seems to have a life of its own, behaving differently on any given machine...

    You might want to try re-converting, or maybe converting to another format first, then importing to Kontakt?

    Good Luck
  19. skwids

    skwids Forum Member

    Messages:
    26
    Woops

    I took a chance there, dfloyd!!! Sorry about the mix up. It's just that you talk just like Derrick Floyd, a creative consultant of ours who helps us demonstrate at trade shows! I figured dfloyd and the "sweet talk" comments were a sure fire match! Although, I was a little puzzled at the immense interest in VSL! Especially when Sonic Reality is distributed by the same distributor for VSL here in the US.

    Anyway, sorry about that and unfortunately I can't just send you Sonic Station. I can perhaps work out a deal for you though. ;) By the way, you wouldn't happen to be David Gilmour either Mr. Floyd? (do you accept charges? Are all these your guitars?)

    So, for the record (relevant to this thread) I think we will be releasing about 30-40 Kontakt native format libraries this year. So for we've released two: Sonic Station and OmniSoundz. But, we also have some killer drum libraries and even orchestral stuff as well coming out.
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