Beatgrids for dummies?

Discussion in 'TRAKTOR SCRATCH' started by jipperz, Jan 16, 2008.

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  1. jipperz

    jipperz New Member

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    6
    Hey folks,

    First off apologies since I realise this issue has probably been addressed loads of times but I was wondering if there is a (foolproof) guide anywhere for foing this in TS?

    I have been reading loads of posts etc which have probably served to frustrate me even further..

    Is it really as complicated as it sounds?

    A step by step guide with any tips etc would be very much appreciated.

    Thanks :)
     
  2. Macaque

    Macaque New Member

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    572
    It's not hard but you need to practice doing it rather than just reading. It's not as complicated as it sounds ;) IMO the manual explains everything fine, just read it carefully, then keep practicing and you will get it soon enough.

    I don't think NI like people making guides because these could be utilised by people with illegal Traktor copies.
     
  3. CraigKC

    CraigKC Forum Member

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    66
    Ever heard of cutting off your nose to spite your face?

    As an application developer myself, I hate when companies hamper product growth, development, and adoption out of fear of piracy. NI has several policies that make legitimate ownership more difficult than piracy, so I fear your assessment may be correct.

    Honestly, the biggest reason I bought torq first (even though it sucked) was here: http://www.torq-dj.com/videos/index.php . If NI had something similar, I think they would attract many more "first time" or "learning" DJs.

    Honestly, if your open policy with demos, documentation, and help allows you to gain 30% market share, who cares how many people pirate it in addition to that? Market share is success, success is power, power is money. When you dominate the market, then take strong measures to eliminate piracy (which coincidentally was the exact strategy from day 1 of a little company called Microsoft).
     
  4. jipperz

    jipperz New Member

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    6
    thanks mac.. managed to get it sorted (I think)

    Only thing now is... could someone explain how the beatgrids work? I have found using the tick when I have my cues set to be very useful.. I am just wondering how the beatgrids manage to work? Say, for example, I have a turntable that needs serviced and loses time slightly.. So long as I have the BPMs matched on TS the tracks will never lose time?

    Sorry.. just trying to understand better and the only way you ever learn is through asking :)
     
  5. Macaque

    Macaque New Member

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    572
    In Traktor Scratch, a wavering turntable will knock your mixes out of time, it is just like using real vinyl. However, after beatgridding a track correctly, your phase meters will be 100% accurate which makes beatmatching very easy. You can even beatmatch without the need for headphones :)
     
  6. djm1k0

    djm1k0 Forum Member

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    35
    so help me to understand this as well, all i have to do is beat grid one track and then all are good or i will have to beat grid each and every track once ? it's a little confusing.
     
  7. DJ Freshfluke

    DJ Freshfluke Traktor Mod Moderator

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    26,765
    one beatgrid per track (in 99%)

    if you can get the T33 manual - the chapter about setting beatgrids is improved there compared to the TS manual.
     
  8. djm1k0

    djm1k0 Forum Member

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    ok so is there a way to beat grid all tracks at once ? i have many many tracks to many to go back and grid now so it's probably easier top just grid them as i go. i will look around for other helpful tutorials for beat grids.

    thanks !


     
  9. DJ Titan

    DJ Titan Forum Member

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    32
    when setting cues AT THE BEGINNING OF A BEAT, instead of setting a floating cue, make it a grid by using the drop down menu.

    do this again in the middle, then towards the end. if by the 2nd or 3rd grid cue is not lining up with the white lines (BEATS) simply take the mouse over the area where the yellow bar shows when beats arent matched, the click+drag up or down and watch the lines match the beat.

    i think the easiest way to do this is in snap mode.

    hope that helps, im still learning too :D

    i think you have to do it track by track, just like in ableton, but once you do one, it should be done forever.
     
  10. bigbadselecta

    bigbadselecta Forum Member

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    628
    can't NI make this part of the documentation available for TS users too? I know it's a copyright violation if I ask someone to give me a copy of the documentation, but then it sucks to know that there's a better documentation available for T33 users...
     
  11. DJ Titan

    DJ Titan Forum Member

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    32
    i dont think you can set beatgrids in ts.
     
  12. DJ Freshfluke

    DJ Freshfluke Traktor Mod Moderator

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    26,765
    of course you can. please have a look at the manual first before giving a wrong tip next time...

    @ bigbadselecta: i am not authorized to hand out that part of the manual to you, but you may ask support if they are willing to do regarding this special chapter. it's basically the same as in TS, but i added some pictures and rewrote some of the sections a bit.
     
  13. DJ Freshfluke

    DJ Freshfluke Traktor Mod Moderator

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    26,765
    right.

    NO! that's painfully wrong!
    if you have to set more than one beatmarker per track, the tempo is still not right and has to be changed with the both buttons below the bpm display in the bpm panel!
     
  14. djm1k0

    djm1k0 Forum Member

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    35
    i've read the instructions in the T33 manual and for some reason i still can't seem to get it right. i know from readin here everyone says its tricky at first but then really easy once you get the hang of it but i'm still not 100% sure. So i find the second beat, i add a cue their set the grid and use the click it goes on point for a bit and then falls off how do i compensate/fix the beat when it falls off and so that i can prevent this from happening ? if anyone can send some pointers or direct me to any good tutorials it would be greatly appreciated !


    thanks !


     
  15. frequencym

    frequencym NI Product Owner

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    136
    Perhaps knowing what a beat grid is will help. A beat grid consists of two things:

    1. a cue point
    2. an exact BPM

    When you create a beat grid you are telling Traktor "this cue marker is right on top of a beat" and "this is the exact BPM of this track". Because you have set the BPM to the exact value then if you pick any beat you know where the other beats will land.

    Obviously this will only work on tracks that are sequenced; if you are playing something like disco or tracks performed live then the BPM will vary slightly through out the track and getting an accurate beat grid will be impossible without some post production on your part (such as beat warping in Live to flatten out the BPM). Note that tracks ripped from vinyl may also have drifting BPM's depending on the speed accuracy of your turntable.

    So assuming you have a track that has a constant BPM you have to set the two values mentioned above (cue point and exact BPM) ; this is what the Traktor instructions are telling you to do (in a wordy and confusing way). It basically boils down to getting a cue point on beat, letting it generate the grid based on what Traktor guessed the BPM was, then you scanning forward in the song. As you find the grid drifting off beat you adjust the BPM to get the grid back onto the beats.

    Note that you have to be careful; if you jump ahead in a track a several minutes it's possible that you have drifted off by more than one beat at that point, and if you lined up the lines you would still be one (or more) beats off.
     
  16. SimonStokes

    SimonStokes NI Product Owner

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    117
    Leaning to beatmatch by ear is time better spent than beat gridding I reckon - what happens if someone gives you a bunch of vinyl to play at a party? :)
     
  17. djm1k0

    djm1k0 Forum Member

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    35
    i am a vinyl dj so i'm good with beat matching with vinyl. i'm new to the digital format and producing so i'm still trying to get the hang of beat matchin without actually touching vinyl. it's totally different but i know with time will become second nature like vinyl is to me.


     
  18. djm1k0

    djm1k0 Forum Member

    Messages:
    35
    ok this makes sense to me. i am able to set the cue point right on the first second or third beat. from what i read people say to use the second beat in the track is this correct ? if so then i've done that. and was able to clik on grid and create the grid on the waveform. now the confusing part i guess is setting the bpm to the exact value. how do you do this ? becuse there is tempo knob right above the waveform and then there is a tempo setting on the top of the window i think near the master clock. where do you set the BPM ? once you set the cue point and then you notice it start to drift how, when and where do you correct it ?

    i really appreciate everyones patience with me, i know this is going to be one of those things that i'm gonna kick myself in the ass and be like DUH that was so easy. it's probably easier to see someone do it them to try to explain in words.

    thank you thank you !


     
  19. frequencym

    frequencym NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    136
    OK, assuming you have Traktor 3.3 with the "Effects & Master" layout active; on page 3 there is a box labelled "BPM". This is what you use for beat gridding. You'll see the BPM in the middle left; the buttons above the BPM nudge the entire grid (i.e. your cue point) left/right and the buttons on the nudge the BPM up/down. The latter two are the ones you want to adjust the BPM. Sometimes you might find that your initial cue point isn't as accurate as you first thought, you can use the former buttons to nudge it a hair if needed.

    There are also buttons to half/double the BPM, turn audible ticks on/off, and tap tempo.
     
  20. DJ Freshfluke

    DJ Freshfluke Traktor Mod Moderator

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    26,765
    i cant think of a reason why one should use the second beat in a track... if possible, i always use a "1" of a bar, be it the first beat or number 5 or later in the track (e.g. if the intro doesnt show good enough waveform to place the grid cue point).

    bpm panel.
     
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