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create BiSaw Sync in Reaktor 5.6 (not Blocks)

Discussion in 'REAKTOR' started by TheTick, Jan 13, 2020.

  1. Big Gnome

    Big Gnome NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    479
    Is the very top-level reset inlet set to audio or event? Because if it's audio, it'll spew reset events at the sample rate and you won't get an output (or you'll get a constant DC offset like you were describing earlier). This would be the first thing I'd check.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2020
  2. Moshe B

    Moshe B NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    126
    It's actually really weird that this not works for you - I'm not sure what went wrong for you over there. But if that is happening because of the differences between R5 & 6 so I am not sure how can I really help you..sorry.

    edit:
    01.png I have try to put this in my core cell to check if I get the same problem as you do, but its still works fine for me - I hope you find a solution and get it to work..don't give up :)
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2020
  3. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    3,239
    I suspect something related to this as I've already said. However, if the rest is properly implemented, it should filter out all but positive zero crossings to the internal reset input, because only initialisation and positive zero crossings should get that far.

    The first thing to do though is to check if the core cell inputs are set to audio or event (I asked this in post #29)
     
  4. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    3,239
    TheTick It turns out I still have Reaktor 5.9.4 on my system, so if you're on that version (or earlier), you can upload your ensemble and I'll check it out - would probably be quicker that way.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    Hey colB, Moshe and Big Gnome.
    Well, it turns out that Big Gnome was dead on. My entire core cell was an "Audio" cell and not an "Event" cell.
    So I copied all of the contents over from audio to event - reconnected and bingo! We have audio and everything is working perfectly.
    colB if you still want me to upload it let me know...
    Again, thanks for all of your input and what a fantastic place this is for people to learn, experiment and get answers without any ridicule or criticism.
    Have a great weekend all!
     
  6. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    3,239
    TheTick
    Yes upload please.

    IIRC Your core cell should be an audio cell because it is generating audio. However some of the inputs should be event inputs and some(one at least) should be audio. It's possible to get audio from an event cell, but it's not 'ideal'. I'm kinda surprised it works at all as an event cell without some extra trickery. Particularly as you can't have audio inputs or outputs in an event core cell?!
    (Best is to upgrade to R6 where there is only one type of core cell.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2020
  7. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    Ok, attached is the macro that contains both the old (unattached) Audio core macro plus the new Event macro that works.
     

    Attached Files:

    • Like Like x 1
  8. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    3,239
    Ok, I made some changes.

    The whole thing should have been in a single audio core cell. Note that the sync input is in audio mode and the rest are in event mode as per my earlier suggestion.
    I also replaced the hacked z-1 with a R5 library z-1.
    It's now basically the same as the original version I posted but in R5.

    Also added a modulating waveform for testing, then another tweak so that changing the reset phase doesn't cause zippering because it is now only applied on initialisation and sync resets.
     

    Attached Files:

    • Like Like x 2
  9. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    Awesome - I will check it out soon. I am in the middle of developing a video but will see what you did so that I can learn a little more about the process.
    Thanks again colB!
     
  10. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    Hey colB. During my test of the BiSaw - it wasn't synching properly. When I paired it with another built-in sync waveform - and then set both to sync, the BiSaw kept changing start positions and would not keep restarting from the beginning of the phase. Any ideas?
     
  11. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    3,239
    Are you talking about Primary oscillators, or Factory Library core oscillators?
     
  12. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    Primary Oscillators - Sine Sync, Pulse Sync etc...
     
  13. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    3,239
    It works as expected here. Maybe if you explain with more detail and pictures etc. But I tested here against a Primary sync sawtooth, and with the bisaw phse reset set to 0.5 and width set to 0, they seem to behave the same.
    Remember that the bi-saw is free running... maybe that's the issue?
     
  14. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    When you say that the BiSaw is free running, but we can control sync and phase, that confuses me a little.
    With a Midi Gate hooked to Sync input of any sync-capable oscillator, and a fixed value set for the Phase, with every key push, that oscillator should restart from the position set by the Phase number - correct?
    So my test was to set 2 oscillators up and repeatedly press the same note on the keyboard and look at the oscilloscope.
    The waveform should be exactly the same with every key press. And that is true with the built-in sync oscillators in Reaktor primary.
    When I put in the BiSaw and set it up the same way as described above, the waveform on the scope keeps changing - that is what I am going by.
     
  15. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    3,239
    gate signals don't go negative, so positive zero crossings don't happen. You can tweak the internal logic to get it to work. currently the sync logic has a <0 and a >= 0, if you change the < to a <= and the >= to a >, it should work with 0..1 gate signals.
     
  16. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    Roger that! I will give it a try and let you know...
     
  17. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    Hey colB - ok, I made a quick video that shows 1. a steady Sine Sync (primary) wave with our BiSaw wave added to it. You can see the BiSaw ever so slightly moving - which means that the pitch is not steady or that the phase is wandering. Plus when I repeatedly strike a key, the position (phase) of the BiSaw keeps changing. I am also including a pic of the setup used to make the video.

    upload_2020-1-21_8-34-53.png
     
  18. colB

    colB NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    3,239
    try subtracting a small fraction from the gate signal - maybe 0.01...
    What seems to be happening is that 0 != 0. So the gate is not causing a syncable event.
    This issue is a potential problem with floating point numbers although it really shouldn't be according to the IEEE standard - 0 and 1 should both be represented exactly. Maybe it's down to the mantissa being different or something... not sure. Anyway, subtract a small value from the the gate before sending it to the sync input.
     
  19. TheTick

    TheTick NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    105
    Hey Guys - well my synth is all set up and if you want a quick hit on what it sounds like - check it out...
    The BiSaw is one of the Oscillators in the synth...