Maschine & Traktor Sync - Beats keep sliding out of sync, Help please!

Discussion in 'MASCHINE Area' started by FreakyMofo, Jun 11, 2012.

  1. FreakyMofo

    FreakyMofo NI Product Owner

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    195
    Hey people.

    I have just recently sync'd up my Maschine to Traktor, and im using the STEP feature in Maschine to add some snares/hats/sounds over my mixes in Traktor,

    However, after the duration of 1 track, 5-10 minuets, my sounds in maschine starts to slide out of sync with traktor and this happens every time.

    I've spent AGES playing with the 'Sync Offset Slave' on Maschine's Preferences and I've moved the slider up and down to try and get Traktor's and Maschine metronome synced up, and that has worked, but as soon as i play a tune in Traktor, it doesn't sound so in sync at all, sounds off,

    I'm REALLY itching to start proper getting into using the pair sync'd up in my sets, let me know if you would like me to attach photo's of all my Traktor and Maschine settings.

    I followed this video to sync them together: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Jh0BORgfEo&feature=related"]Syncing Maschine to Traktor using 1 computer tutorial - YouTube[/ame]

    Im using MacBook Pro 15 (late 2008 model), Traktor Scratch Pro 2 (version 2.1.2), Maschine (version 1.6.2). Audio 10, Pioneer DJM 500. x2 Kontrol X1's.

    I'm sure its nothing to do with with my set up, i just must not be pressing/doing something properly to keep them permanently sync'd together.

    Thanks!
     

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  2. trux

    trux NI Product Owner

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    753
    yeah, for whatever reason, maschine doesn't seem to stick to the midi clock of traktor. apparently it works better if you use an actual midi cable from masch to your soundcard and route in traktor, instead of virtual midi connections.

    you can map the midi sync button in traktor to a midi button on a controller, maybe on one of your x1's, so you can occasionally resync it if it starts drifting.

    i am finding, for my needs, that the new traktor 2.5 remix decks are the best way to get maschine loops and beats in traktor. matt celliti at dubspot just did a vid on moving loops from masch to traktor.

    i don't know if it will make much of a difference, but you could also update your maschine software to latest version 1.7.2
     
  3. FreakyMofo

    FreakyMofo NI Product Owner

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    195
    Thanks for the reply.

    Right, if I get a MIDI cable to link Maschine to my Audio 10, what else do I need to do after that? Can you post a link to a youtube video that shows syncing Masch and Traktor via midi cable?

    Also, the same with mapping a sync button to 1 of my X1's, can you explain how to do that or know of a video?

    I have been wanting to update my Traktor to 2.5 and Masch to 1.7, but im just worried that ill have to sort all my settings out again, and i lost all my library in Masch last time i tried to update to 1.7

    Also, I will be wanting to use the STEP feature in maschine, to play some claps and kicks etc over traktor, ia this possible if i use the Remix Decks & maschine option that you said?

    is it safe now?

    Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2012
  4. trux

    trux NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    753
    i don't have traktor in front of me, so sorry if the answers are a little vague.

    i haven't tested the midi cable method, but i think it is just a matter of getting a midi cable and going midi out from your soundcard, and put that into midi in at the back of maschine. then setting up traktor as master, maschine as slave, picking the corresponding midi ins/outs in preferences - pretty much the same way as doing it virtually. i don't have a midi cable at home so i haven't tested it yet...

    you can make a user map for the x1 or use whatever midi controller you like - you could even use maschine in midi mode. == in traktor == go to the controller mappings and there should be a function for resync midi clock, and you can learn that to a button - you could even map it to a qwerty keyboard button.

    hm, i've never lost a library in maschine from update, but you could back up your samples before making the plunge. i think you'll be surprised how good the beat detection is in traktor 2.5, and the remix decks are worth checking out.


    if you want to be doing the step sequencer to construct a beat live, you'll have to do that in maschine as remix decks don't really let you construct a beat like that, its more for playing stems or oneshots and remixing them together. so, if you had 10 beats that you wanted to use in your set, you could export them from maschine in stems like - hihat loop 1, sub bass loop 2, etc. and then you can play/remix with those pieces all in traktor.

    some people use masch in standalone, no midi sync, running in the background, and just beatmatch it in to a traktor set - by matching tempo and playing it at the right time. you could route the audio thru a live input in traktor if you wanted to cue maschine, use traktor fx and filters etc. on your maschine sounds.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2012
  5. noiserot

    noiserot Forum Member

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    1,865
    You shouldn't lose your library or your settings at all when updating Maschine.
     
  6. psynapse

    psynapse Forum Member

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    Works fine for me!

    I've even forgotten i've had a Maschine track still playing after muting the channel fader on my mixer, only to bring it up maybe an hour later to find it still locked tightly to Traktor's Master Clock.


    If you make sure you have Snap and Quantize enabled, this helps when triggering the initial Clock Send message that goes out to Traktor. You can of course re-send the sync message at any time, and nudge the master clock up/down to get it in time, but honestly once you do that it's golden!
     
  7. FreakyMofo

    FreakyMofo NI Product Owner

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    195
    That's okay dude your answer are good.

    Okay, I'm going to try out the MIDI from Maschine to Auio 10. I will update u when I get one wether it works better or not.

    Maybe mapping it to a button on my MacBook keyboard could be a better option as I wouldn't want to replace what a button does on X1 on case I realise I need to use that specific button. I'm going to look deepe into this remapping business.

    Yes that is exactly what I want to use Maschine AND Traktor for, is the step sequencer. Its wicked, totally a bit of me!
    Tbh it's THEE main reason I brought it, to use it for live stuff in my sets. Of course I could still just play pre-recorded patterns and sounds over Traktor too, but just doing it live is so satisfying.

    You've just said what I want to do! Route Maschine into a LIVE INPUT on Traktor, reason being - when I click 'Record' on Traktor, after Ive recorded a set and listen back, I can NOT hear Maschine, like the sounds/loop I've played over Traktor. An NI support person told me I'd have to route Maschine to live input in Trakt, but what you just said, "use Traktors FX via the X1, over whatever I'm playing on Maschine". THAT is something I've being wanting to do. Any help on routing Maschine as a live I out to Trakt? Is it easy?

    Does it limit some of the features on Maschine tho? Or can I still do Everyrging I could on it, like step sequence etc.

    Thanks a lot.
    ---
    Really? Ah that's good to know it's working for somebody. A relief, I'm sure I must just be not pressing the right button at times, could you further explain how to enable 'snap' and 'quantize'.

    By 're-sending the sync message' is that the 'SYNC' button above the ' (|>|| )play/pause' button in the Global section on Traktor? Because when I hit that sync button while matching the metronomes up, its always 'jumpy' and never syncs up right.

    Thanks for your reply. What version are you running your Traktor and Maschine on?
    ---
    Okay I will update both of them when I'm home from work tonight. I jus had problem with 'user path' last time. And it was just head-f*cking.

    I will break the barrier of progressing the the latest update tonight lol. Cheers.
    ---
    @Psynapse - Also, what is your MASCHINE>Preferences> Sync Offset Slave set to? - ?

    Also, in Traktor>Settings>Midi> ms, what is that set to on yours? Thanks.

    Someone told me to keep Traktors ms to 0. And Maschine sync offset slave to -17. Not sure if it's different on different laptops.
     
  8. Pjotr123

    Pjotr123 NI Product Owner

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    187
    So this is how I routed Maschine as Live input to Traktor:
    - I take an output from audio 8 (for me channel C and shortcut it to input channel C;
    - In Machine set output to channel C (5,6);
    - In Traktor set Input Deck C to audio8 (5,6);
    - In Traktor set Deck C to Live input.

    Works like a charme. I can use Traktor FX on Live input and use S4 to mix, eq etc.

    Sync wont work (at least not for me). I use manual beat matching. Stable and fun ;) The main problem why sync is not stable via midiclock (flutter) is that it uses the internal clock of the operating system for timing. That internal clock not always have the highest priority within the operating system all the time. So flutter has nothing to do with Traktor or Maschine, but depend on the operating system (at least within Windows). Not sure about Mac though.

    Maybe NI can find a way to circumnavigate this in the future.
     
  9. FreakyMofo

    FreakyMofo NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    195

    Right, so you didn't even use 'soundflower' or any of the virtual audio apps that people have recommended? Maybe your way is better, it sounds easier.

    Does it limit Maschines uses after u route it to a live input on Traktor? Does step sequence still work fine?

    I imagine the only difference made is (for the better) that u can now add Trakor FX over Maschine, and now be able to record what u do with Maschine, via Traktor's record feature.
     
  10. Pjotr123

    Pjotr123 NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    187
    Step sequencer works perfectly. That's what I use in a Live mix. I like to use the master for sync. So I mapped the tempo offset buttons on S4 to tempo bend the master. Everything in sync and no midiyoke, midicables and so on. Tried everything, but this is the easiest and most stable setup :D
     
  11. FreakyMofo

    FreakyMofo NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    195
    Ok great! Your using Traktor S4 right? Dow the method you used to route Maschine to a Traktor live input work outside of the S4? On just a Traktor Scratch, Maschine, MacBook pro set up?

    I've just posted a new thread on how to route it using soundflower or jack os x. Cos apparently that is the best most stable way!

    I'm off work now that it's the weekend so looking forward to just having free time to properly play with my set up and sort it all out!
    ---
    I am still yet to try your method tho! I am going to try the way u have .
     
  12. Pjotr123

    Pjotr123 NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    187
    I do use the S4, but use my audio8 as soundcard with Traktor set to internal mixer. Within Maschine, audio routing Out 1 set to audio8, 5, 6 (channel C). Maschine Groups send to Master within Maschine. Master out (Maschine) to Out 1. Than on audio8, link the audio out (5,6) to audio in (5,6) with cables. Within Traktor Trackdeck C input set to audio8, 5,6. That's it. No soundflower, midiyoke, Loopbe, midiclock via LAN, or midicables. Tried all of them, even my Ecler EVO4 as master. Finally, this setup works best for me. Good luck :)
     
  13. FreakyMofo

    FreakyMofo NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    195
    Hm, I use external mixer... Not sure if it will work the same :-(
     
  14. Pjotr123

    Pjotr123 NI Product Owner

    Messages:
    187
    That should still be possible. I see you have the audio10. That means you have 5 In and 5 Out. Just use one of them to route Maschine, as described, to Traktor. Works the same. Only thing is to connect the four Tracktor Decks to the external Mixer via the audio10.
     
  15. GI Trackt

    GI Trackt New Member

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    1
    Pjotr123, can this be done using a Kontrol Audio 6? You have inspired me to look into Maschine again because I gave up on LoopBe1 on my PC!

    My only gear is Apc40 and Traktor internal mixing. Can I run 4 decks with maschine being one of the 4 (as a live input like you said) using the KA6 (I would create that shortcut as you did on the Audio8) ? I dont use turntables or anything else. I simply want Apc40 + Maschine as one of the channels and I'm trying to figure out the audio interface that will allow me to do this..

    Thanks so much!